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Restore maple weapons to original GMS stats

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by House M.D., Dec 6, 2017.

  1. House M.D.
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    House M.D. Horny Mushroom

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    10:23 PM
    Hi, I noticed that warrior maple weapons in this server have their accuracy reduced. I believe this is a mistake, and would like to see it restored to original GMS values.

    Reason: for warrior maple weapons, the accuracy is really the only bonus! The only reason you would want a maple weapon over a regular warrior weapon is the accuracy. That's basically the only difference between regular warrior weapon and a maple one, accuracy.

    (well there's the speed bonus too, but that's true for all the other classes as well, not just warrior)

    Let's take claws. A level 60 claw has a 100 dex requirement, and level 70 claw requires 110. Now Maple Skanda (level 64) has NO dex requirement. Therefore, you can equip one with only 25 dex (thief minimum) and pump the rest into your primary stat, LUK. So a Maple Skanda is actually giving you about +80 stat bonus.

    Now a warrior lvl 64 Maple weapon gives +35 accuracy, which translates to about 40 dex. That isn't OP at all, when thief maple weapons give you 80.

    Bowmen and mage weapons also give better bonuses. For example, a regular lvl 65 staff (Evil Wings) has a 68 LUK requirement. Level 64 maple staff has no LUK requirement, so you can keep your base LUK at 4. That's a +64 stat bonus. The 150 HP is just additional gravy.

    Anyways my point is that even at normal GMS stats (+35 accuracy bonus for lvl 64 Maple spear) the warrior maple weapons are actually not as good as other classes' maple weapons. And by nerfing that to half, you've made it EVEN WORSE.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2017
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  2. iZeke
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    iZeke Mano

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    I'm in favor of this idea.
     
  3. Sam_Vosh
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    Sam_Vosh Capt. Latanica Retired Staff

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    6:23 AM
    SamVosh
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    Elemental wands exist. Lvl 130 wands which do not require Luk, so maple wands and staffs won't be used at all. No contest. Thus only a vanity item.
    For Archers, 80 dex = 16 w.att. A lvl 110 (x)bow gives more then 16 w.att then the best Maple bow. So maple bows are not used at all and thus only a vanity item.

    Assassins in particular can get the Raven claw. A lvl 80 claw which requires no dex. So better then the maple claw. Besides, it has already been proven on this server that low dex NL is better then a no dex NL. The w.att scaling on NL's is absurdly good. Thus only a vanity item.

    The only Maple weapons worth considering to keep were the old statted warrior maple weapons. However, in light of the first event where maple weapons were released. The sheer bonus of accuracy of the Maple weapons made them the only end game weapons worth having for warriors. To not have the warrior Maple weapons so overpowered, the GM's have nerfed them by reducing the accuracy by half.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  4. R0wdy
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    R0wdy Pink Teddy

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    Do you have a quick link/reference, or ELI5? I don't doubt you; I'm genuinely curious.
     
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  5. Sam_Vosh
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    Sam_Vosh Capt. Latanica Retired Staff

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    Unfortunately not. I'm taking the word of the most dedicated member who tried to do so a few years ago. A friend went no Dex NL back when ML just released and she discovered in the summer vacation that low Dex NL damage range was starting the catch up more above lvl 130. It seems Triple throw does not benefit as much from Luk as lucky 7 does.
     
    • Informative Informative x 2
  6. OP
    OP
    House M.D.
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    House M.D. Horny Mushroom

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    10:23 PM
    Seriously? End game weapons? You're telling me that high level warriors were going around killing Bigfoot with maple weapons?

    I'll just say that I've played on a lot of different servers, and I've never, ever seen anyone wanting to nerf 2nd job warriors because of maple weapons. There seems to be some really weird thought processes going on here.

    What I do hear everywhere, in both official GMS and private servers, is that Hermits/Night Lords are too OP. Back in 2007 there was a joke, they called the game HermitStory. And yes I have seen attempts by several private servers to nerf 4th job NLs because, it really is true that NLs are OP.

    Also 3rd job DKs were considered OP in the old days (before 4th job was released). Hell, I remember people saying BMs are too OP right after 4th job was released because with SE they had the highest solo DPS in the game.

    But 2nd job warriors too OP? That's a new one.
     
  7. Sam_Vosh
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    Sam_Vosh Capt. Latanica Retired Staff

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    It's true. Nightlords are over powered in this version. And seems to be in most v62 servers.

    Actually Corsairs have the highest solo DPS in V62. Battleship cannon easily does more then BM's solo. Of course, Corsairs get beat when NL get Sharp Eyes.

    End game I refered to 4th job, not 2nd. Hero's, Dark Knights and Paladin's going around with Maple weapons because the only weapons better are too rare or the strength gained from not needing Dex anymore giving enough DPS. 2nd job warrior isn't OP. It's 4th job warrior classes only going for Maple weapons what is.
     
  8. Awliya
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    Awliya King Slime

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    1:23 AM
    Maple weapons blow dick for end game weapons
    Anyone who disagrees is either delusional or bad at math

    However Kimmy has a gripe about how easy 30 ACC allows for dexless warriors
    I personally don't agree since you can do dexless with or without 30 ACC maple weapons but whatever
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  9. OP
    OP
    House M.D.
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    House M.D. Horny Mushroom

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    10:23 PM
    Okay I think I'm getting the gist of it now.

    It's not 2nd job warriors that they tried to nerf, it's 3rd/early 4th jobbers going around holding lvl 64 Maple weapons.

    That's correct, the difference in WA between a lvl 110 Dragon weapon and a lvl 64 maple one is so great that 35 accuracy can't possibly make up for it. If you're still using a Maple weapon as a 4th jobber, it's because:

    1. You're poor and can't afford decent equips
    2. Server just got started so there's nowhere to buy high level weapons (but maybe they got Maple weapons from event?)
    or
    3. you're just dumb

    Anyways if the intent was to prevent 4th jobbers from going around holding Maple weapons, how about just nerfing the level 64 Maple weapons while restoring the level 43 ones back to their original stats?

    2nd job warrior is crappy and very very far from OP, as I believe most people would agree. If you've ever done a Ludi PQ with a warrior in your party, you'd know what I mean. Basically goes like: miss, miss, crap dmg, miss, miss, crapdmg, miss, decent dmg
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2017
  10. Awliya
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    Awliya King Slime

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    1:23 AM
    Nobody uses dragon weapons either lmao

    Hero = Red Katana/Stonetooth
    Paladin = Crushed Skull/Stonetooth
    DK = Sky skis

    Some people who have constant SI also consider Dragon Claymores
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  11. OP
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    House M.D.
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    House M.D. Horny Mushroom

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    Really? They have reverse weapons in this server?
     
  12. Awliya
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    Awliya King Slime

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    No dragon weapons are fuckin' trash for DPS
    The only one that is anywhere near decent is the 2 handed sword; dragon claymore which only beats stonetooth if you have SI

    NOTE THIS IS FOR WARRIORS

    Also we don't have reverse weapons
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2017
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  13. Shinohara
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    Shinohara Headless Horseman

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    ☆ Aqours ☆
    With the exceptional of elemental staffs and wands, dragon equipment series are the highest level equipment currently implemented.
     
  14. Kimmy
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    Kimmy Administrator Staff Member Administrator Game Moderator

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    There's currently no plans to remove the nerf done on warrior maple weapons, since this is a nerf done by myself, and for reasons in 2015. Warrior is my main job and over the years I've never liked the amount of accuracy they gave and how they completely destroy the weakness of warriors, while they are locked behind an event only item.

    P.S: 35 accuracy is much more than 40 dex.
     
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  15. Ghost.
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    Ghost. Nightshadow

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    None of the original warrior maple weapons would come close to end game weapons. The argument for nerfing the accuracy of warrior maple weapons was so warriors would use other weapons. However, since Legends has gone easy mode this is no longer a valid argument. A midly funded warrior using normal warrior weapons + dex/acc items could easily outdamage a low-funded warrior using a normal warrior maple weapon. And this only matters for 3-4 weeks until everyone switches to their actual end game weapons (RKs, STs, Sky Skis, etc...). Nerfing maple weapons made sense 2 years ago when the server was difficult, but now it makes no sense.
     
  16. Awliya
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    Awliya King Slime

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    Yea I agree, even with very modest gear, you could get enough accuracy to be dexless now, I don't see a reason why maple weapons should remain nerfed
     
  17. Kimmy
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    Kimmy Administrator Staff Member Administrator Game Moderator

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    The nerf wasn't done because I do want prevent dexless warrior, it was done because I just find 1 weapon having this much accuracy to be bad. This was done with absolutely no other weapons in mind.
     
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  18. Awliya
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    Awliya King Slime

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    All the other classes get cool shit, why not warriors
     
  19. Sam_Vosh
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    Sam_Vosh Capt. Latanica Retired Staff

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    What cool shit do archers get?
     
  20. Awliya
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    Awliya King Slime

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