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Quick balance discusion

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by KurayamiLove, Oct 26, 2019.

  1. KurayamiLove
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    KurayamiLove Skelegon

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    I know there are still changes coming out soon and but who knows perhaps I can smuggle some ideas for them before they do anything or future patches. I wanted to do a much better post with images and colors but this will have to do.
    These are some ideas I had in mind for some time that could make jobs better overall.

    -BASE FORMULA CHANGES-
    >Corsair DEX to avoidability formula to be avoid=DEX*0.25 + LUK*0.5
    >Reasoning: That's the formula that all jobs but pirates have, corsair current DEX to avoid ratio is avouid=DEX*0.125 + LUK*0.5, that's half the acc that any other adventurer job would get from DEX, changing this the avoid will match Archer jobs and would help them a lot to take care of their ship.

    >Dagger multiplier increased from 3.6 to 4 for Thieves.
    >Reasoning: STR daggers can be worn by warriors and when they do they have a multiplier of 4, the 3.6 is only for Thieves, so making it always 4 for all jobs that wield daggers would make Shadower a lot better, besides their brother NL use a multiplier of 5 when they use TT or Luky7.

    -MARKSMAN-

    >Strafe speed increase from 630ms per cast at cap speed to 600ms per cast at cap speed
    >Reasoning: Bow users have that speed when using the same skill, using a Crossbow is a bit slower even at the same speed, so why not make them even, at the end of the day Marksman keeps using this skill after 4th job.

    >Make Blizzard capable of crit
    >Reasoning: The rest of the skills can so why not this one too?

    -PALADIN-

    >Threaten defense lowering effects being a % instead of a fixed amount. 20% would be a good number.
    >Reasoning: This would make this skill actually useful, especially at higher lv bossing.

    >Threaten duration buff from 60 secs to 200 secs
    >Reasoning: 200 secs seems like a standard time for this kind of supportive skills altho this is a debuff for a mob.

    >Holy charge DMG increase from 140% to 175%
    >Reasoning: The 4th job charge is completely useless, by matching its dmg with Fire Charge it may make it more useful, as a way to keep the 175% dmg boos on fire-resistant bosses like Leviathan or the future Pink Bean. Also, it would give it use on Holy weak mobs that are also weak to Lighting (Lightning will still be a very relevant charge to have since most of NT bosses are weak to this charge and not Holy).

    -DARK KNIGHT-
    >Crusher speed increasde from 810ms per cast at cap speed to 750ms per cast at cap speed
    >Reasoning: DK dmg dealing is a bit lowe compared to any other warrior class and it can feel a bit unfair since you also have to keep Berserk on to even deal decent damage, and after using a lot more pots than the rest of classes you end up with okish damage at best, this buff will keep them still weaker than the other warriors but a bit stronger so they can keep up a bit and get more rewarded from keeping Berserk up.


    -4TH JOB THIEVES-

    >Ninja Ambush formula buff from Damage per second tick = 2 * [STR + LUK] * Skill to Damage per second tick = 10 * [STR + LUK] * Skill Damage Percentage Damage Percentage, perhaps even more since this skill is a joke.
    >Reasoning: This skill is a joke, only skill that is worst than this skill is Final attack.

    -BUCCANEER-
    >Corkscrew blow and Backspin Blow mob hit increase from 3 to 6
    >Reasoning: Pushing bosses can be annoying with the 3 mob limit if there are way too many mobs around, also this would make it a better tool since all your skills also hit up to 6 mobs making them have more synergy.

    >Charge changes: 1 Could be add an indicative on how long the skill last since as it is now you know when it starts but you have no signs that show up when the effect is about to expire beside mental tracking the time. And number 2 a duration buff to 120 like on alter versions to make this skill a lot more reliable and convenient.
    >Reasoning: This skill is very important for the job so make it more comfortable more than a buff would be a quality of life change.

    >Stun Mastery tweaking so you always get the 160% bonus dmg except for the 60% and at times 160%
    >Reasoning: how this skill works is weird, the description says it adds 60% dmg on crit but the img file it says is 160% (Like sharp eyes says its 40% but is actually 140%) but it actually only adds 60% the 160% bonus only comes when you have Sharp Eyes, so by making it always do the 160% bonus would make this skill make sense and not need to rely on Sharp Eyes to get the full bonus, this is more of a fix than a buff. And remember since you need to stun first before getting any boost of damage you won't be 1 shoting anything anyways.

    -SHADOWER-

    I love Shadower but is a bit lackluster and I really think this job should be a lot better, so here are some suggestion I think that would make Shadower a lot better:

    >Assasinate fix: This skill is a mess, I don't know if all of the changes I have in mind can be applied but here is my idea of a functional Assasinate.
    - Remove the crit lock
    -Reasoning: this skill canot crit on the first 3 hits, even with Sharp Eyes they cant, since most if not all the damage lies on this 3 hits (4th is often canceled) making these hits able to crit would make this skill a lot better
    -Remove the need to go to Dark Sight
    -Reasoning: This would speed a lot thier 1vs1 combo, using Dark Sight would still be a good thing to do during cancels or downtime to start with good damage.
    -Reduce the damage from 600% per hit to 300% but double the amount of hits the skill does
    -Reasoning: Would make Sharp Eyes a lot better when using this skill

    >Meso Guard buff from 50% to 60% and duration buff from 120 secs to 200 secs

    >Reasoning: Shadower is quite tanky but at the same time it isn't a small buff on resistance could helm them a lot to tank hits, also making the skill last longer would make them not lose as much time rebuffing, 200 secs will match it with booster durations.

    >Band of Thieves dmg increase from 210% to 310%

    >Reasoning: I always felt this skill was a bit too weak so perhaps a bit more damage could make Chief Bandit a bit better at grinding without having to rely on bombs.

    >Assaulter damage boost from 450% to 500 %, increase range and decrease of delay between uses.
    >Reasoning: The damage boost is just to match boomerang hits, the rest is so Shadower becomes a lot more mobile since they cant have Flash Jump.

    >Chakra changes removing the 50% hp or less restriction, removing its animation delay on the character (Like Shadow Star cast delay doesn't make the NL stop attacking) and make it have a small cooldown for 10 seconds
    >Reasoning: Making this skill viable is hard, this could make them get free heals every 10 seconds, with enough LUK you can fully heal yourself, this could add to the theme of Shadower being a tanky job.

    >Smoke Screen cooldown reduction from 10 mins to 5 mins (The cooldown goes from 10misn to 5 at max level) and make Smoke Screen avoid status.
    >Reasoning: This skill can make your team take a break on bosses but the long cooldown hurts its impact on the team so making it more available could make this a much better support option, also being able to avoid status too could be a huge deal since not all status come from damaging attacks bypassing Smoke Screen, effects like stun, seal and zombify from the CWPQ bosses, as well as HT Seduce.

    >Double stab damage increase from 130% to 170%
    >Reasoning: Being a melee rouge is objectively the worst build for Shadower making them go sindit to be better, I know people still chose that route but well ppl play beginner past lv 10 too so...



    And that's all, I hope to have a good discussion with all of you. Have a great day.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Great Work Great Work x 1
  2. Lidas
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    Lidas Mixed Golem

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    Crossbows are stronger but takes longer to reload. Thats why its like that.
    Dk have the best party skill between warriors so they get the worst dps. maybe with hp washing its kind of taking something from them but soon there will be bosses that require both hb and hp wash.

    I agree with shadower smoke and paladin threaten.
    For smoke screen another balance can be to make it a demand on some bosses. For example when boss move to 2nd body it will attack with 30k damge.

    Also would like to see balance to archer mobility. I suggested before a longer attack range. Will be nice to see other ideas.
     
  3. Hito
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    Hito Stone Golem

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    Rebalance zerk to 99% HP.
     
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  4. Annolis
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    Annolis Skelegon

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    I agree with the Page/WK/Paladin Threaten skill. I would also include a failure rate determined by level. That way a level 50 Page can't do a 20% debuff to Skeles. So if a formula is included for a failure rate such that the player's level needs to be at the same level as the mob or higher to ensure a 100% success rate, then I'd be in full favor of this change.
     
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  5. OP
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    KurayamiLove
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    KurayamiLove Skelegon

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    DK is the weakest still after this buff, I just think that for all the trouble you go for to get more damage (Zerk management) you should do a bit more damage, yes you do have one of the best supportive skills in Maple but what that implies is just you press a button every few minutes, on non Zerkable bosses you just feel like a mule.

    Crossbows do have a better multiplier but a small buff will make them much better overall and could be able to be closer to BowMaster damage at higher levels.

    When comes to Bowmen mobility is hard to adjust since they already have a skill that increases their speed, with items they easily get passive Haste all the time, and they are already the job with the most range.
     
  6. OP
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    KurayamiLove
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    KurayamiLove Skelegon

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    Hmm that success rate you are talking about, I'm not sure if that can be implemented, but damn thats a great idea!
     
  7. OP
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    KurayamiLove
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    KurayamiLove Skelegon

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    I also wanted to think more about Corsair but is hard to buff them, giving them more numbers won't cut is since they are already the best dps class, the issue is that NL with its super avoidability will always come on top. The DEX to avoid ratio matching Bowmen could help but I'm not sure what else could be good for the job.

    *Edit*
    Also I wonder if its possible to "fix" Rush so is consistent, sometimes you fall down the platform, sometimes you don't even make it to the end of the platform so you don't hit the middle head of HT or reach well the arm when you are cleaving
     
  8. Lidas
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    Haste without jump attack is not useful.
    I always thought nl and archers got the same range. Anyway i still think a buff to the range is needed to make it more noticeable.
    Another idea is to make dragon breath work at close range. Or buff mortal blow.
    And another is to able jump attack. But i think it wont go well with thief and archer theme. Although they gave jump attack to gunslingers too so idk.
     
  9. OP
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    KurayamiLove
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    You also get jump from equips like from the scar Helmet or the Mark of Naricain, somehow I managed to make my DK have 120% jump at all time o.o and some speed.

    Another buff I wanted but seems I forgot to put is make Dragon Breath work up close and make bot Dragon Breath and Ninja Storm work on all mobs that are not bosses. Seems some summons like Wyverns from HT or some Zak summons canot be knocked back by these attacks.
     
  10. akashsky
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    akashsky Horntail

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    I jump attack with my corsair all the time using rapid fire and cannon. It is very useful to keep dishing out damage when getting knocked away from a boss. (like the pirate boss in cwkpq).
     
  11. OP
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    KurayamiLove
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    Jump attacks could be added to skills like strafe, but to skills that are rapid fire like Huricane? hmmm
     
  12. Hyoon
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    Hyoon Zakum Retired Staff

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    You can always jump attack on strafe it just takes a certain skill and timing to do it.
     
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  13. Lidas
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    Im talking about jump to the back and attack. To make distance so you dont melee attack. I see this as the main problem. but sure after that nl (im not sure about corsair) still have better map control in most maps. And the jump forward attack is something you can say why its kind of balanced.
     
  14. Annolis
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    So a skill like the Gunslinger's Recoil? I think the Knock-Back Skill for the Bowman is the equivalent to Recoil. I'm not in favor of making the classes too much alike. When GMS let Warriors have their own personal Heal skill AND a personal FlashJump skill - the game just got stupid. I like seeing definitive attributes and skills for each class.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  15. OP
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    KurayamiLove
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    KurayamiLove Skelegon

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    yep that with all skills the thing is that it doesn't add too much if anything, the reach doesn't increase tho since the reach is calculated from the position you jumped from, unlike real jump attacks that are calculated when you press the key in the middle of the jump. And doesn't feel natural o.o
     
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  16. Lidas
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    Lidas Mixed Golem

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    No. Both gun and claw users can jump back and attack without any skill.

    Knock back isnt always working. And its not knocking far. This 2nd job skill work good only on low level mons in my opinion.
     
  17. DCheng377
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    DCheng377 Snail

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    I think the shadower should be more stronger!Band of Thieves need more faster!Add Flash Jump or Mesos Up ,please!
     
  18. Annolis
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    Annolis Skelegon

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    The Shadower has its own form of Flash Jump, it's called Assaulter. Again, not every character should be exactly the same - otherwise, why bother having distinct classes? As for Band of Thieves, I don't understand why the damage output gets reduced when a new "Self" is added. Since this is clearly a Mobbing skill, wouldn't it be better to hit 5 mobs for max damage than 6 at a reduced damage? Maybe I'm unclear as to the advantage(?) of having the damage reduced in order to add a sixth hit.
     
  19. OP
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    KurayamiLove
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    KurayamiLove Skelegon

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    It is impossible to add FJ to Shad, but hey making assaulter much much better will make them so much cooler and mobile. Also, shadower has meso up, is a skill named pickpocket, and you don't even need to kill the monster to get profit!! since pets are able to loot pickpocket mesos this jobs can get you lots of mesos, and the more dmg you do the more meso you get!! (They even had to remove wooden puppets from fm to fix them and readdem on china cos Shadowers kept exploiting them to get millions of mesos)
     
  20. OP
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    KurayamiLove
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    KurayamiLove Skelegon

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    Maplestory is weird man, that logic is applied to other skills, one of them being Crusher from DK, you start up hitting 2 times to 1 mob, then to 2 and finally to 3 mobs, then when you get to hit 3 times you are back to hitting one and you need even more levels to be back to hitting 3 making this skill pretty much shitty until high level. I think how skills like this grow could be changed tho.
     
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