1. Hello!

    First of all, welcome to MapleLegends! You are currently viewing the forums as a guest, so you can only view the first post of every topic. We highly recommend registering so you can be part of our community.

    By registering to our forums you can introduce yourself and make your first friends, talk in the shoutbox, contribute, and much more!

    This process only takes a few minutes and you can always decide to lurk even after!

    - MapleLegends Administration-
  2. Experiencing disconnecting after inserting your login info? Make sure you are on the latest MapleLegends version. The current latest version is found by clicking here.
    Dismiss Notice

ToS suggestions - A clean slate

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by yurain, Dec 18, 2020.

  1. yurain
    Offline

    yurain Windraider

    423
    96
    301
    Dec 30, 2019
    12:25 AM
    YUrain
    I/L Wizard
    55
    Allow for player's non-permament game abuse and player abuse records to be cleared after a certain period, such as 6 months to 1 year, depending on the type of offence committed.

    Such as those 5 days/ 7 days/ 10 days ban. If the player didn't commit such offense within a certain period, the next offense of the same category will be considered as a "first offense" again, instead of being an account or perma ban.

    I would like to see a general view on this first, before substantiating my suggestion further. Thanks for commenting.

    Edit: for specific suggestion. (18/12 1359)

    With more people (try hard) bossing, everyone will exploit the game to its limit. The ways to boss abuse is really more than the simple few being listed in ToS. You may or may not be aware of them actually being abuse, until you got reported and banned. But we all know that shit lot of things goes unreported. Your party might be boss abusing without you being aware of it, even if it is how the game was designed (intentional or not).

    Boss abuse is like a booby trap for the players going to bossing given the vague criterion stated in the ToS, unless you know the mechanism of the boss inside out. Or after you got reported/banned and realised "oh I can't do that". But there are so many bosses in ML, while this ToS clause only gave you 1 chance. This Boss Abuse thing should be more suitable for the clean slate suggestion, so as to give the players more chance to learn and not fk themselves up.

    On the other hand, Boss Abuse is also one of the only abuse that doesn't inflict damage to other players. More recovering opportunities should rightfully be given to it.
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 2
    • Like Like x 1
  2. Kimmy
    Offline

    Kimmy Administrator Staff Member Administrator Game Moderator

    10,963
    10,999
    551
    Sep 9, 2014
    The Netherlands
    6:25 PM
    Moderator Post
    I have seen an other server doing this on their forums and basically people started abuse it as much as they can to barely get them out of perma bans each time. Example lets say you need 10 points (or 3 strikes) to be perma banned; people would re-abuse again if they know they wont be perma banned anyway.

    The system how it is now is fine as it is, which gives you plenty of chances. We will probably not end up perma banning you for a dumb petty ban, unless you really messed up.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
  3. OP
    OP
    yurain
    Offline

    yurain Windraider

    423
    96
    301
    Dec 30, 2019
    12:25 AM
    YUrain
    I/L Wizard
    55
    That is a very valid reason. But then may I narrow down to a specific ToS that made me think of this thread in the first place.
    I will edit the OP in the thread to be more specific.
     
  4. Diziple
    Offline

    Diziple Pac Pinky

    190
    20
    191
    Jun 23, 2017
    Male
    12:25 AM
    HappyGuY
    Dragon Knight
    70
    None
    You will only learn when you feel the pain, don’t you?
     
  5. OP
    OP
    yurain
    Offline

    yurain Windraider

    423
    96
    301
    Dec 30, 2019
    12:25 AM
    YUrain
    I/L Wizard
    55
    Or you will learn when it is clearly stated for you to learn.

    Edit. You will only learn what there is need for you to learn.
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  6. Diziple
    Offline

    Diziple Pac Pinky

    190
    20
    191
    Jun 23, 2017
    Male
    12:25 AM
    HappyGuY
    Dragon Knight
    70
    None
    I think the TOS covers boss abuse quite reasonably. Maybe you can provide some examples to substantiate your claims?
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  7. OP
    OP
    yurain
    Offline

    yurain Windraider

    423
    96
    301
    Dec 30, 2019
    12:25 AM
    YUrain
    I/L Wizard
    55
    I don't really wanted to do this, because it might seems like I am speaking up for certain people, even though I am not related to them.

    It just makes me aware that there are ways to boss abuse within understandable design of the game, and most of them is really not very clearly stated is the ToS. Instead vague terms like "intentionally causes monsters in boss maps to stop using abilities or attacking"
    The clean slate thing is just a suggestion I came up to help out the intentional unclear wording regarding boss abuse clause, that I feel player should deserve.

    I also want to add in a disclaimer. I don't boss, but I have no way to find out certain specific action is abuse or not despite it might be sound in theory. I think the thread will end up as the usual boss aggro thread where goes (oh well, nothing I can do about this).
    welcome to the chicken and egg problem
    No clear example will be given because then everyone knowing those abuse exist and exploit them(because we can't catch em all).
    You don't know what is abuse (until you gets banned), because there is no clear examples.
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 2
  8. Soblet
    Offline

    Soblet Zakum

    1,374
    1,348
    491
    Sep 14, 2015
    6:25 PM
    Soblet
    Bandit
    200
    Pasta
    If you encounter odd behaviour that you think might be a bug contact a gm about it? I don't think you have to keep exloiting a bug for long enough to get banned to find out if it's allowed or not.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  9. Diziple
    Offline

    Diziple Pac Pinky

    190
    20
    191
    Jun 23, 2017
    Male
    12:25 AM
    HappyGuY
    Dragon Knight
    70
    None
    In this case, shouldn’t your suggestion be more on detailing the clauses rather than revising the current penalty system.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  10. xiaoyaoz
    Offline

    xiaoyaoz Balance Team Staff Member Balance Team

    194
    129
    196
    Jul 17, 2020
    Male
    5:25 PM
    Here is an example of boss aggro abuse comparison which I don't really get:
    1) Range attack last arm of HT from opposite side of body to avoid any form of attacks = Aggro abuse
    2) Range attack last owl statue of PB from a far distance to avoid any form of attack = NOT aggro abuse

    In case 1, the benefit of doing that is to avoid a 10sec seduce which probably won't kill anyone or delay much of the run.
    In case 2, the benefit of doing that is the owl killing part is shortern by at least 30% (considering the long duration from DR/seduce).

    So, some would say... well... for PB it's intended mechanics while for HT it isn't meant to be so.
    Then, that begs the question how would I know what are intended and what's not?
    Do I just @gm every time I found a new trick/strategy to work around a boss? Hm
     
    • Agree Agree x 8
  11. fartsy
    Online

    fartsy Zakum

    1,335
    790
    471
    Jun 29, 2017
    Male
    11:25 AM
    Fartsy
    F/P Wizard
    Pasta
    Just preemptively @gm every boss (pq bosses, manon, zak, ht, toad, krex, etc). Something will happen eventually when staff sees a torrent of requests - better safe than sorry yknow (^:
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  12. Ferluci
    Offline

    Ferluci Zakum Retired Staff

    1,473
    442
    460
    Jul 27, 2017
    Male
    6:25 PM
    Ferluci
    Bishop
    186
    Don't do this. @GMing without any reason is bannable. @GM when something happened, not preemptively
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Informative Informative x 1
  13. IHateApple
    Offline

    IHateApple Horny Mushroom

    47
    12
    56
    Dec 19, 2017
    9:25 AM
    IHateApple
    Dragon Knight
    I feel like GM should handle this case by case using the number of boss you have killed instead of by the number of the offense, just like roll scam. For example, if you got banned for aggro abuse in HT before, but this time is your first time in PB which you don't familiar with PB mechanism at all. When the host or your party member is abusing the bug to make PB freeze, in this case it's hard for first timer to tell if this is bug or not.

    But if this is your 50+ or 100+ HT run, but you are abuse arm aggro even this is your first offense, I think GM should account ban that guys instead, since he already familiar with the mechanism which there is no excuse to say I don't know this is a bug not feature.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  14. Slime
    Offline

    Slime Pixel Artist Retired Staff

    641
    1,185
    381
    Apr 8, 2015
    Male
    Israel
    7:25 PM
    Slime / OmokTeacher
    Beginner
    102
    Flow
    I don't know much about bossing, so I won't comment on that.
    but regarding the penalty system suggestion, I agree. However I think staff are already taking into consideration time since previous offence when perma banning people.
    Better to leave it up to their judgement than to change ToS with specifics and have it be abusable.
     
  15. Shivering
    Offline

    Shivering Wolfspider

    537
    207
    325
    Mar 9, 2018
    9:25 AM
    Shivering
    I/L Arch Mage
    183
    This is the equivalent of saying don't call people out publicly or you will get banned. Sure that's nice in theory, but we all know its never enforced and is a meme.
     
  16. Kimmy
    Offline

    Kimmy Administrator Staff Member Administrator Game Moderator

    10,963
    10,999
    551
    Sep 9, 2014
    The Netherlands
    6:25 PM
    Moderator Post
    We've already banned people for calling others out though. Just not all bans are announced, like harassment bans.
     
  17. Ferluci
    Offline

    Ferluci Zakum Retired Staff

    1,473
    442
    460
    Jul 27, 2017
    Male
    6:25 PM
    Ferluci
    Bishop
    186
    We enforce this quite often. Not all bans are announced so you'd not know every one of them that happens.

    edit: oh yeah what Kimmy said. :D
     

Share This Page