Alt Tab Hurricane and Consistency Across different OS

Just speaking on this matter, I think the right side/left side differences between MM/BM advantages is a meta specific issue that's been shifting heavily in favor of MMs. In the past, it was common for groups to split damage evenly on heads so as to reduce the number of double/triple cancel situations, so Bowmasters stayed on the right side for a longer period of time, thus being put in their optimal situation for longer. However, in the current meta, single-target heavy compositions with 0 cleave will focus down right head as soon as possible so as to not trigger right arm debuffs and then move left for a longer duration of the fight. For lower level/avoid Bowmasters, left side is cancer and they suffer from a significant DPM loss simply due to how Hurricane works - BM damage output is directly related to how stationary they can be after starting up Hurricane. On the flip side, Marksmen have a significantly easier chance of outputing their upper-bound damage because of how strafe and snipe work. On the left side, if midhead is cancelled, Marksmen can still sneak in a strafe or a snipe to frontload about 8-10 damage lines of Hurricane every time the left head ducks, while Bowmasters resort to sending out their weaker strafe, arrow rain, or rebuff while they have nothing to hit (this also applies to right side anytime midhead is cancelled). Likewise, if left head is cancelled, Marksmen can jump onto plat and buffer a strafe and still manage to get however many lines of strafe/snipe out, effectively frontload DPM despite their briefly stationary position. Even if the next attack knocks them down, they still would have managed to frontload what could be comparably 1-2 seconds of Hurricane.

Of course, the gap thins out a bit when comparing to level 200 versions of BMs/MMs with higher avoid and better practice with repositioning, but even then, Marksmen have a much better time from the utility of Blind.

Honestly, I don't really care for this debate between BMs and MMs even though it seems to come up in every other thread that's not about HP washing. Hell, I have a Marksman myself. For the most parts, I'm glad Marksmen were given that extra love and care over the past year or two and that they're finally relevant as a class. These are the types of balance changes I think most people approve of since it seems additive instead of reductive.

I just find it disheartening that over the past few years of playing a BM, the only changes we'd received is an undispellable Concentrate (that stemmed from the Hero/Enrage debates of 2020). In the same time, we've gotten our Hurricane drop-rate reduced and our previously allowed alt tab hurricane feature turned into a 'fixed bug'. It seems like we've gotten more things stripped down from us than given back in return since 2018 (shit that's already 4 years ago).

Hell, even Nightlords got their Shadow Star bugs 'fixed', but for some reason they were given a soft reversal in the form of a duration buff that nobody had asked for.

Just seems weird to me.

 

Because I play a Bowmaster? Bowmasters and Marksmen serve the same role in being Support DPS through SE - that is their primary role and it's why they're added to any composition. This would be akin to having two different Dark Knight classes that can both offer Hyperbody, but one would be given a different set of skills that offer more utility to the party while still doing comparable - if not more - damage. The weaker DK would be completely phased out.

Having one class do more damage and offer more utility basically makes the other irrelevant. A lot of balancing has been done purely on speculation of dummy dpm because I highly doubt staff has the time or manpower to test things out in real situations. It's growing more and more apparent that dummy dpm and theoretical dpm charts shouldn't be the standard measure for class balance discussion.

 

That's a totally fair compromise. I'd be happy with any positive change towards Bowmasters in general, even if it happens to be mostly a lateral move (5 line strafe, etc.).

I'm thinking about also making a new HT DPM 40 thread - one that's not about flexing your dpm, but simply cataloguing different class/level data. I think it would prove to be very useful.

Also don't apologize for derailing the thread - I'm actually the worst offender of that haha.

 

Doesn’t count, wing damage.

 

Yeah, fuck alt tab hurricane. Foot hurricane mule on pc #3 can be the new meta.

FWIW, DreamMS allows alt tab hurricane.

 

But you understand that you technically are allowing it on MapleLegends in admitting that it's basically undetectable in its current form.
This is the entire premise of my original post - there seems to be a way to replicate alt tab hurricane using OS-specific features that are not disallowed. Sure, you can say that it's frowned upon and doesn't go along with the spirit of the server, but to say that it's not allowed while also shrugging your shoulders saying there's nothing we can do to detect it seems confusing, no?

This was my point - if it's not fixed to be consistent across all user experience, the policy itself should be changed until it can be.

I feel like this whole situation is very similar to GTOP in their attempts to tighten up on people 'abusing' the system in multivoting. Their tunnel vision on trying to prevent a few people from going about their sweaty ways ended up creating a worse experience for most, and in the end, they reversed their decision.

As you know, Neckson never intended for Holy Shield to protect seduce, but it was deemed a good thing in the end with how the player base took this 'bug' and incorporated it into the Bishop identity. You've adopted things as features in the past. I'm not sure why alt tab (or any other lateral change) can't be considered and possibly tweaked to be better balanced. Like I said in the few posts above, all the changes Bowmasters have received in the past 3-4 years have been reductive making the class less and less interesting, especially while every other class has been getting their shiny new toys (even NL).

Edit: Also, it's pretty disingenuous to imply that the devs at Dream aren't able to fix alt tab hurricane. They've implemented walking hurricane and such. They've implemented alt tab hurricane as a feature.

 

I'm just asking Staff to see what their thoughts are on this discrepancy before I go and build a new computer.

 

I mean, so are Bowmaster mains. :V