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Hero Panic rework

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by iccqqq, Apr 26, 2022.

  1. iccqqq
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    iccqqq Dark Stone Golem

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    Ok i have found a way of buffing heroes without making it a complete custom mess.
    PANIC:SWORD / PANIC:AXE atm does 400%damage and 90%dark power(wtf is this?) at max level
    my suggestion would be increasing the damage from 400% to 500% and on top of that making the skill apply a debuff of -200 or -300 wdef for 20-30 seconds on the monster/boss hit.
    i think with this change the class will benefit of more single target power and more active gameplay.

    also i have 1 more suggestion: pls consider making PANIC:AXE/COMA:AXE only do SWING and PANIC:SWORD/COMA:SWORD only do STAB.
    ty
     
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  2. Cak33
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    Cak33 Headless Horseman

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    the -200/-300 wdef seems to buff the entire party squad. not sure how much damage improvement it does but, considering zakum3 has 1200 wdef, I guess 10% damage improvement (for whole party) doesn't seems unrealistic. which makes it feels like a second echo.
    Do correct me wrong if anyone here did the math

    With that in mind buffing enrage to 30wa seems to be alot more tamed in comparison compared to this, and even den, 30wa enrage is considered too OP.

    400%->500% panic alone not gonna do much imo, brandish afk should remain superior in DPM
     
  3. Imberos
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    Imberos Horny Mushroom

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    Both hero and paladin have the same problem at 3rd job. Their attacks cancel certain buffs (combo and elemental charges) so they have to rely on 1st job skills all the way to 120 (123 for paladins).
    I agree this mechanism should be reworked
     
  4. OP
    OP
    iccqqq
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    iccqqq Dark Stone Golem

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    makes it feel like a second echo for like 20 seconds, truly insane.
    dont forget you sacrifice a shitload of dpm to cast and recharge all orbs when using this.
    with this change hero benefits from not only more damage but also better party play and playstyle in general.
     
  5. Cak33
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    Cak33 Headless Horseman

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    upload_2022-4-27_15-26-32.png

    Did @epm 3 two times at shaolin dummy.
    Top epm 3 -> pure brandish
    Bottom epm 3 -> consistent 10x Brandish + 1x panic

    Both epm 3 -> starts from fresh ACA, 0 charge when initiated.
    Buff used: Rage, ACA, Booster, MW20
    Weapon used: NT 1h + shield

    DPM difference: less than 5%

    My range if interested:
    [​IMG]


    Ahh yes, 5% is shitload of dpm loss for a permanent "20 seconds" 10% damage increase for the entire team (technically +5% to yourself too overall). 10x brandish doesnt take 20 seconds to fully cast.
     
  6. -ovv
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    -ovv Horntail

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    The best rework to Heroes panic would be how it affects the charges. Personally, I would like to see Enrage reworked so that in addition to the 26 atk buff, Combo Orbs regenerate at double the rate while Enrage is active. This would allow for a niche scenario where Heroes can crank out slightly higher single target dpm by meticulously casting Panic every time they hit max orbs.
     
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  7. Imberos
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    Imberos Horny Mushroom

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    The real test is 1st job attack VS 1st job attack + panic.
    Brandish is 4th job so it should be stronger
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  8. Cak33
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    Cak33 Headless Horseman

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    If you are comparing power strike then, even in the current state, panic + power strike is much stronger then soley power strike. Then, what are you exactly trying to achieve with a panic rework?
    Slash blast is out of the question, if you gonna hit multiple u should use coma instead.
     
  9. S_tieralbum
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    S_tieralbum Brown Teddy

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    OnionMuha
     
  10. OP
    OP
    iccqqq
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    iccqqq Dark Stone Golem

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    if it seems so OP then maybe giving panic a cooldown would be the way to go, or reducing the -wdef or time the effect lasts.
    i cant see any other way of improving the overall gameplay and power of the class besides reworking panic.
    oh yea, the classic +watk enrage.. :hungover:
     
  11. Cak33
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    Cak33 Headless Horseman

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    well unfortunately any form of damage boost for other party members can easily deemed as too op, even if its as little as 5%.
    And if its only a damage boost to yourself, only on single target, then as with the previous threads, its either no point, for pally still do more damage, or too op, for u do as much or even more damage then pally (pally loses class identity)

    nise and found it too OP and rejected it.
    tho you didn't seem to feel the same way. if thats the case, why are you against it?
     
  12. S_tieralbum
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    S_tieralbum Brown Teddy

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    The classical argument here is that Hero, being already the strongest cleave class in the game DPM wise, benefits redundantly from a flat DPM increase like > Enrage WATT. Having slightly better cleave and still being significantly worse at single target only makes the problem worse on two ends

    Panic buffs (to pure damage, at least) only affects Hero's single target, giving room to adjust the problem area without creating new issues where Hero is already faring very well

    But the -WDEF idea on the other hand kind of just throws both of these ideas out the window and turns Hero into another Sharp Eyes lite
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  13. OP
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    iccqqq
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    iccqqq Dark Stone Golem

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    buffing enrage will just make the class stronger at cleaving rather than solving the lack of single target power.
    if panic is buffed and becomes an essential skill, the class will benefit of not only better single target power but also a more active gameplay.
    only reason i can see for anyone to object this is because they love paperweight brandish so much that they cant let it go :sneaky:
     
  14. OP
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    iccqqq
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    iccqqq Dark Stone Golem

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    i added the -wdef concept so that panic would work smoothly with brandish.
    for example using ACA>PANIC to -WDEF for xx seconds>BRANDISH until PANIC -wdef effect fades>PANIC again
     
  15. Cak33
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    Cak33 Headless Horseman

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    I agree with this. Had a discussion argument last year and came to the same conclusion.

    But WDEF, isn't it more OP? I don't have max enrage to test. But here's what I think:

    Assuming a +30wa enrage gives hero an additional +10% damage in both single and 3-mob cleave damage. In a 6-man party single hero party. maybe provides 2% damage increase when compared to the whole party in single target boss, and 6%? damage increase in CWKPQ. This is considered too OP.

    Now comparing to this suggestion. By pure panic damage, you lose maybe 4% (500% damage buff). With -WDEF, WHOLE PARTY, except you gain 10% damage increase in SINGLE TARGET BOSSES while you gain 6% damage. Overall, probably maybe ~9.5% damage increase. Is this supposed to be not OP?

    Imma just quote BananaPie this time:
    https://forum.maplelegends.com/index.php?threads/warrior-balanced-change-thread-all.36721/page-4
    Idm holding down panic too if it doesn't reset orbs if its made not OP :)
    Also, just saying, but you can always play paladin :sneaky:
     
  16. LeonardoJF
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    LeonardoJF Zakum

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    The buff need to be with damage to not be muled:
    this suggestion is good, but coma/panic is a 3rd job skill and u can use with a pico pico hammer (1 hand sword that have 1 att to deal no damage) and come outside the main party to use it as a mule and don't steal exp as main attacker
     
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  17. Cak33
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    Cak33 Headless Horseman

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    Time for LUK hero to rise
     
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  18. OP
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    iccqqq
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    iccqqq Dark Stone Golem

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    No point in Even talking about this leonardo since everything in this game can be muled
     
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  19. LeonardoJF
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    LeonardoJF Zakum

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    yeah yeah, but a dpm buff is better than party buff
     
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  20. OP
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    iccqqq
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    iccqqq Dark Stone Golem

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    well bro i tried coming up with a unique way of improving the hero skillset, making it not only better at single target but also at party play. what else can i say im not great with numbers.
    unfortunately it seems like youre gonna respond with ''OP'' every time you get the chance.
    maybe next time youll come up with a creative way of improving a certain class yourself instead of criticizing everything and not adding anything besides ''TOO OP'' to the suggestion. :sleep:
     

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