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An alternative way to HP/MP wash

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by ooShawnyoo, Apr 27, 2022.

  1. ooShawnyoo
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    ooShawnyoo Dark Stone Golem

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    Hey all!

    Hope you are well.

    While I was training I was thinking of how we could implement an alternative way to washing so we don't have to use a lot of leech/mesos if someone would want to do it a different way. Instead, it would cost more nx. This could be a very bad idea, or not even possible to do, but I thought hey, it doesn't hurt to share this idea and see where it goes.

    I was wondering if it was possible to create a certain token that you can buy in the cash shop, that would add one point of INT to your character. Instead of having to sacrifice a point in your main stat to add to INT, you can choose to spend more nx to have an extra INT point added to your character.

    To make this balanced and reasonable, it would have to follow certain rules, like:

    • One nx INT token = 1 extra base INT added to your character.

    • You can only use this token on a non-magician character.

    • You can never have more nx INT than the number of total stats you have acquired by leveling. Example: If you are level 20, that means you have obtained 95 stat points, meaning you can only use a maximum of 95 tokens, not more.

    • Also, if you would try to use nx INT tokens while also adding base INT to have even more INT and still use leech as a leveling method, you would only be able to have as much INT as your level would normally permit. Meaning if you are level 20 and have already used 95 points in INT on your character, you would not be able to use any nx INT tokens. If you only have 65 points used in INT, you would be able to use a maximum of 30 nx INT tokens . This is to avoid double dipping.

    • To avoid having people just keep that extra nx INT forever to level 200, we could count in that nx INT in the total amount of stats a character can acquire by going all the way to 200 (I believe it's 995 points?), meaning if someone is level 200 and has 300 nx INT on their character, they won't be able to apply more than 695 points in any stats until they remove points from nx INT, they will have 300 unusable fresh AP. If the person is level 165, and has 200 nx INT, they would have 795 points in his other stats, and 25 unusable fresh AP until he removes some nx INT. (This is to help leveling while being low level but make it less worth it for those wanting to use nx INT when high level. Not sure if stopping you from using your fresh AP as you level in this situation would be hard to code)

    • nx INT would count as base INT for washing purposes, but would be in its own separate pool (in the code that is) so that the game can actually make the difference between real INT and nx INT, and would probably use a 'special' nx INT AP removal item from the cash shop to remove points from it. (I guess same price as AP resets?)

    • I am not sure about the cost of those tokens, but I was thinking of making 4 different types of tokens that would have different prices. A 1st job token, a 2nd job token, a 3rd job token, and a 4th job token. If you are a 1st job character, it would be cheaper when you buy a 1st job token. But if you are 3rd job, it will be pricier, and you will be forced to buy a 3rd job token if you want it to work.

    • To keep track of how many tokens you have used(how much nx INT you have), maybe the game can create a stackable cash item in your inventory every time you use one? It would just have a simple description letting you know it's proof of having used a nx INT token. Every time you would use a nx INT AP removal, it would remove one from your inventory.

    Basically, if someone would decide to use nx INT tokens instead of regular int while leveling, they would be able to level their character normally, adding their points into their main stats as someone normally would, and be strong enough to level without having to leech. Of course, it would be a lot more expensive nx-wise. If someone wants to spend less nx, they can just add regular int to their character and buy leech like people already do right now . It's their choice.

    I may have forgotten something game breaking about this idea, or an exploit that people could find. If you think of anything that could make this idea work better, please share in the replies. And I do realize this could be a challenge to code into the game, if it is even possible to do. But if it is, it could reduce the number of people using leech,especially during the lower levels, helping a tiny bit the fact that the server is just filled with leeching currently. It could populate maps a bit more and PQs. It would not necessarily make it "easier" for new players to do HP/MP washing, but I feel like it is easier to get nx everyday through voting than being funded to buy powerful INT equipment and leech the whole way. It would depend on the cost of those tokens.

    What do you think? Does this idea even make sense? Is it too custom? Is it too complicated? How much do you think those nx INT tokens should cost (1st/2nd/3rd/4th job)? What about the nx INT AP removal?

    Let me know what you think! Thanks! FoxF2
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 8
  2. Jafel
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    Jafel Capt. Latanica

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    ???
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  3. Jean
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    Jean Wolfspider

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    the problem to add INT to other jobs is will take less magic damage so no.
     
  4. OP
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    ooShawnyoo
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    ooShawnyoo Dark Stone Golem

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    I don't remember if INT affects mdef. If it does, make it so that nx INT doesn't benefit mdef, only mp gain from leveling and MP washing.
     
  5. Jean
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    Jean Wolfspider

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    hmm HP/MP wash still hard for me to understand but i have to respect your opinion i hope someone will share idea or what they think about this.
    man i shouldn't post here mostly because of my bad grammar and i don't want to make my words sound mean or something.
     
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  6. Estrahl
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    Estrahl Mr. Anchor

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    I'm a little confused on how this is conceptualized.

    So, the average person puts about 260 or more into their base INT, unless they have int gear which affects MP gain per level.

    256*3100 =793,600 vote cash required to reset that back into your main stat, once you have the base INT required.

    Assuming you vote every day, averaging 5500 per day(not including any vote bonuses or 12h votes because it's a conservative estimate) it takes about 145 days, or about 5 months, to get that amount of vote cash.

    If you vote for an entire year, youll get just a little over 2m in vote cash.

    Assuming you only level a few times a week, while also considering you probably don't actually start HP washing until level 90-120, you should have plenty of time to gain the vote cash required to AP reset.

    Now, with all that in mind, would further gating(or, not gating, but offering alternatives) HP washing via more vote cash sinks be a good idea? How much more would be necessary? Granted the average wash cycle costs about 1.3-1.7m vote cash, not accounting MP washing, not accounting for the 794k+ vote cash required to get all that INT back. Would we just instead be buying tokens to add around that much into our INT?

    I mean it's not a horrible idea but I feel like it makes things a little complicated. If that INT we invest in becomes a ghost minimum(meaning we can't reset out of it), it becomes a little bit bloated with calculations and whatnot, given that regardless which path we take, it'll still take about a year to reach at or close to the HP goal we want(assuming we start at 0 vote cash on a fresh account).

    Idk that's just a thought I have. Not really against it, just wondering how much it'll complicate things. Washing in general is a somewhat weird concept for people to wrap their brains around.
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
  7. Eleza
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    Eleza Mano

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    This probably wouldn't be possible without actually altering how INT itself works, which would then in turn make mages even squishier. It's not a bad idea to try and find an alternate method, and maybe this idea might pave a way to something else, but I think adding cash items to add stats probably isn't the best way, personally. That, and it's already costly enough just to try and wash (as I am typing this, EstrahlEstrahl just mentioned this).
     
    • Like Like x 2
  8. OP
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    ooShawnyoo
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    ooShawnyoo Dark Stone Golem

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    As you've said, it would simply be a different path people could take if they want to play their character while also accumulating mp (by having more INT) instead of leeching.

    I think what makes it more complicated isn't how it would be used, but rather the constraints that comes with the system, to ensure it doesn't get exploited or isn't fair for those who go the traditional route of adding regular INT and leeching to level.

    Maybe there could be a simpler way of implementing a system like this that works a similar way.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  9. OP
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    ooShawnyoo
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    ooShawnyoo Dark Stone Golem

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    True, it would be very expensive, maybe there could be another way to incorporate something like this.

    In this case however regular INT and nx INT could be two different things ( the latter being used only for washing)
     
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  10. Eleza
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    Eleza Mano

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    The reason I say it may not be possible is because they would have to essentially script a whole new stat if it were to leave INT unaffected. I'm not adverse in maple's code, but that's where things would get complicated. If it's not, then you could take that idea and run with a custom washing stat you gain through these methods you suggested, adding more depth (and possibly ease) to washing on top of the current INT stacking we have to do.

    An alternate thought to avoid this (going off your idea) would be to have nx items that add an amount of hp/mp, if it's possible.
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. OP
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    ooShawnyoo
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    ooShawnyoo Dark Stone Golem

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    I agree, it does seem extremely difficult to implement, perhaps impossible. I wanted to find a way to not make current way of adding INT and washing obsolete, but also adding a way where we can play our characters normally instead of resorting to leech. And the cost of tokens wouldn't be too extreme so it doesn't take you twice as many months or years to have enough nx for everything. For me personally, the wait for nx isn't the problem, it's the mesos and leeching required that I dislike.

    NX equips could be an idea, but then I personally feel like it is too easy as opposed to washing. I feel like people who had to do it the hard way would be pissed.

    It seems to be difficult to find a middle ground between keeping things as is, and completely change HP washing from the ground up (or even removing it).
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  12. Lucidcat
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    Lucidcat Mixed Golem

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    MapleLegends needs washing system to keep its rank.
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
  13. zeroxlr
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    zeroxlr Windraider

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    A potential good way to solve HP Washing using Vote Cash:

    Cash Shop HP Tokens specifically for Warriors, Thief, Mages, Bowman, Bucc, Corsair.

    Each of those Cash Shop HP Tokens give only the amount of HP that's dependent on the overall Vote Cash to MP/HP wash per Token conversion, and are calculated using:

    https://forum.maplelegends.com/index.php?threads/nises-hp-washing-formula-compilation.38558/

    Very Simplistic Example:
    • Warriors = easiest HP washing, so technically just give them more HP/Vote Cash ratio per token cost cheapest
    • Buccs
    • Corsair
    • Thief/Bowman
    • Mages = hardest HP washing, so make the HP/Vote Cash ratio per token cost most


    So instead of using INT, the total amount of Vote Cash used to get to certain HP Goals for each specific class will still be the same Vote Cash Amount.

    Also... still allow the original Washing method to exist with APRs.


    Advanced example for Bucc HP Washing Vote Cash to HP Token Conversion using:

    https://forum.maplelegends.com/index.php?threads/nises-hp-washing-formula-compilation.38558/

    upload_2022-4-27_23-23-36.png

    30k hp = 5,944,250 worth of vote cash on average to MP Wash + Fresh HP Wash + Washing Out Base INT

    5,944,250 vote cash/30,000 hp = 198.141667 == 200 Vote Cash / 1 hp for bucc


    Bucc HP Token = 100hp @ 20,000 Vote Cash <--- could be slightly cheaper


    Note: My calculation is a little on the high side of Vote Cash, since I didn't calculate the possibility of carrying the Base INT, I calculated to wash out the Base INT immediately after MP Washing

    Note2: I have calculations for Thief/Bowman, and Corsair with Vote Cash amounts too. I don't have calcs for Mages and Warriors.
     
    • Like Like x 3
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  14. Esmo
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    Esmo Pac Pinky

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    Just pump 500int and level up it’s not that hard
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 3
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Great Work Great Work x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  15. zeroxlr
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    zeroxlr Windraider

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    Please add constructive feedback on HP Washing suggestions, rather than making funny remarks that are not helpful

    LOL

    upload_2022-4-28_8-31-9.png

    I'm going for 550 Base INT btw and 30k HP on my perma beginner.


    It's actually IS not that hard tbh... but I actually want to help out with this HP Washing Issue.


    Since HP Washing sometimes push people to leave the ML Server, so it's actually a hot topic.
    • This is just one of many suggestion threads on the HP washing issue.

    Washing

    • Vote Cash for server to stay in Ranking on Top Sites
    • Needs Base INT or Leeching before playing character
    • Deters or frustrates new or old players that don't understand Washing, so they leave

    My suggested solution was to tie HP with Vote Cash per class/job, while allowing for people to still play their character.
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Great Work Great Work x 1
  16. OP
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    ooShawnyoo
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    ooShawnyoo Dark Stone Golem

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    Because taking 2 minutes a day to vote and afking while getting leeched is not lazy?
     
  17. Esmo
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    Esmo Pac Pinky

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    depends on how you play there’s a person here on the forums ,made it without leeching and he have like 500base he’s a shadower check his thread SobletSoblet i think it’s him
     
  18. Estrahl
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    Estrahl Mr. Anchor

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    It's just reductive to make simple memey responses. Jokes are fun but it comes off condescending when the default response typically ends up being, "Don't suggest a solution, just do what everyone else does but more intense."

    Suggestions should always be welcome even if you have to question it, even if it doesn't work out.

    Honestly though I didn't realize Soblet did that, sheesh! That's a 1.5m vote cash investment lol. I bet having effectively 60k hp feels/will feel good though, Shadowers are so busted I love them OnionMuha
     
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  19. Cak33
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    Cak33 Headless Horseman

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    unfortunately i would have to disagree with this.
    The main usual issue here is due to a no-cap washing - players can wash indefinitely, further reinenforcing vote2win nature, and pushing every character to 30k HP

    Skuire's HP washing solution (potion itself) imo is the perfect HP washing fix. But well, haven't receive a staff response yet
     
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