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Buff marksmen

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by Selquin, Feb 2, 2020.

How bad MMs?

  1. MMs are balanced and do not need a buff

    25 vote(s)
    20.5%
  2. MMs are under powered, but not to the degree where significant buffs are necessary

    35 vote(s)
    28.7%
  3. MMs are bad enough to the point where significant buffs are necessary

    62 vote(s)
    50.8%
  1. HollyCrap
    Offline

    HollyCrap Capt. Latanica

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    Jul 2, 2017
    Male
    1:38 PM
    HollyCrap
    Cleric
  2. cakesogood
    Offline

    cakesogood Windraider

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    Oct 2, 2017
    Male
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    12:38 AM
    Demun, kokushibo
    Hero
    200
    Honor
    i think another good way to buff marksmen is to add white nerschre to petri drops as it is a drop from non farmed mobs. it also buffs the petri map where you make much less compared to skeletons. This way people can craft dragon shiner bows more often.
     
    • Agree Agree x 5
  3. oohyoo
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    oohyoo Horny Mushroom

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    12:38 PM
    sunjoo/sappho
    wow.. had me in the first half
     
  4. redblueblur
    Offline

    redblueblur Mr. Anchor

    253
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    Dec 18, 2017
    Male
    12:38 AM
    Z00M
    Beginner
    10
    Snipe: turn it into a Passive skill w the ability to toggle it on and off
    • Assuming all XBM are not lazy and maximize their bossing efficiency by using these skills combo: Snipe > Strafe (till snipe cd is over) > Strafe. There'd usually be a small delay of human error of pressing strafe late once Snipe has been used or when it's due to internet latency, which may give way to XBM DPM being slightly lesser than an BM. So, to help XBM be on Par or if not, better, we can assume that this delay in skill casting contributes in some way to this issue at hand. By proposing to turn the Snipe skill into a Togglable Passive skill where when turned on, each time the player uses Strafe, the Snipe skill will be auto casted (once the Snipe skill has been used, will go into the usual cd timer) until the cd is over. Repeating this process, it allows the XBM to hold down strafe and have an auto cast of Snipe.
    PS: not an expert here but here's some out of the box thought, pls advise if some facts about the skills are inaccurate
     
  5. Alyosha
    Offline

    Alyosha Skelegon Retired Staff

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    Mar 9, 2017
    9:38 AM
    Dostoevsky
    Dark Knight
    200
    Spirit
    There's actually a sort of work around for this in skill queuing. If you just put the vanilla skills on the keyboard there are timing issues but if you put them in macros from the side panel on skills you can queue the skills up to automatically cast once you have completely cast the prior skill.

    This means that a Marksman can hold down their Strafe macro, let go of that button during the 5th cast of Strafe, which will queue the 6th Strafe, then while that Strafe is going press the Snipe macro, and while the Snipe is shot you can hold Strafe again. This lets a player cast their skills without any delay between them.

    It works for any class too if you're getting less than the advertised number of attacks per minute.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  6. redblueblur
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    redblueblur Mr. Anchor

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    hmm i see, darn it haha. however, does the macro continue or get harder when the player get hit back from the boss mob? I was also thinking if it'd be a simpler get around for xbm to continue their combo and minimise multi-taskingsince theres no stance.
     
  7. Alyosha
    Offline

    Alyosha Skelegon Retired Staff

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    Dostoevsky
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    Spirit
    It's really only more effective for the dummy or with a boss you can safe. SeemsGood You can get knocked back and then your character will still shoot a Strafe unless you interrupt it with a movement.

    But still, it actually solves a lot of issues for a lot of classes. For me personally MapleLegends seems to massively lower my type speed once I multiclient, which has to be fixed in Windows settings or by restarting my computer. But with attack queuing it is no longer an issue, and I went from 68 to 74 attacks per minute with SI on my DK, which is the amount advertised at an 810 millisecond cast time.

    The sadistic part of me likes the multitask part of playing Marksman. The hitting probably lowers the effectiveness of counting strafes but that's something I can live with as someone who enjoys all of the finicky classes.
    OnionMuha
     
  8. Filter
    Offline

    Filter Slime

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    30
    May 29, 2018
    Male
    12:38 PM
    Filter
    Marksman
    193
    Galaxy
    We might not have to do too much re-inventing the wheel to fix this; closing the damage gap should be enough. Post-Big Bang had a skill called Ultimate Strafe which fired 6 shots instead of 4. If you integrate that into the game as an add-on skill for marksmen, set the damage to 100% per shot (6*100 = 600% total vs strafe's 4*110% = 440% total) and MM end game damage should be a lot closer to BM. MMs would have to spend an additional 10 SP maxing this skill, but it's a notable damage improvement, so w/e. I wouldn't mind re-directing the SP.
    At least that way, you won't have to overhaul how current skills function or keep buffing up a third job skill to remedy the power gap.
     
    • Creative Creative x 1
  9. OP
    OP
    Selquin
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    Selquin Headless Horseman

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    May 28, 2018
    10:38 AM
    Serperior
    Bowmaster, Night Lord, Buccaneer
    200
    Pasta
    Should be careful here, because of how the SE crit damage formula works, curren strafe is actually 4* 266 = 1064%, so ultimate strafe would be 6 * 256 = 1586%, which would be a buff by a factor of 1.5 instead of the 1.36 that you are proposing. I do see your point though.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  10. Filter
    Offline

    Filter Slime

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    Filter
    Marksman
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    Naturally I'm referring to base damage, not the end result. The actual result of this adjustment wouldn't truly be apparent without testing.
    I don't get too bogged down in the math because balancing assumptions are never that simple. I'm just offering up an idea that could likely work after some testing and fitting. And it's definitely going to need some testing and fitting. The beauty of the proposition is that once the skill has been added, only a single number needs to be adjusted to find the happy medium.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  11. Galcian
    Offline

    Galcian Mushmom

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    Jun 1, 2017
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    12:38 PM
    Galcian
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    Make Marksman great again!
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  12. RainbowYarn
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    RainbowYarn Pink Teddy

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    4:38 PM
    Increase the damage of strafe 110% -> 120%.
    It's something.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  13. MrPresident
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    MrPresident Capt. Latanica

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    Dec 19, 2017
    12:38 PM
    MrPresident
    Spearman
    200
    Sorry marksman mains
     

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  14. akashsky
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    akashsky Horntail

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    9:38 AM
    Disparity
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    Blind working on bosses (perhaps at reduced stats) imo would be more than enough to make marksman viable. They don't need to do more damage than bowmasters, if they can fill some NICHE to have SOME advantage over bowmaster (in the END GAME), thats all it needs to make the class balanced and worth playing.

    Snipe going through weapon cancel and damage reflect would also work. This would make marksman have more EFFECTIVE dpm against things that cancel alot vs bowmaster.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Like Like x 1
  15. HollyCrap
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    HollyCrap Capt. Latanica

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    1:38 PM
    HollyCrap
    Cleric
    Make snipe hit through weapon cancel
     
  16. RegalStar
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    RegalStar Nightshadow

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    12:38 PM
    DMsRebirth
    Now that I've been trying to use Pierce in HT a bit, I'm also hoping to see that Pierce's vertical hitbox be made wider. The thing is if I try to use Pierce on the big mid-right platform, I can hit wings and right arm, but the arrow is just a bit too thin to hit midhead there. Pierce's arrow looks really big anyways so I don't think this is that unjustified from a visual point of view either.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  17. Myungsoo
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    Myungsoo Slimy

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    Robinn
    Crossbowman
    Very reasonable. I think that they shouldn't only get a buff. But also do more damage than NL's at brick wall considering that they constantly get knocked back where NL's don't. I'm also a big fan of buffing unpopular classes because some people including me just don't want to play a class that lack damage. If Marksmen would get a delay buff on strafe + a 10 weapon attack buff on Marksman Boost, I would be really happy. There is no reason why BM's should be better than MM's

    (This is coming from a BM main)
     
  18. cakesogood
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    cakesogood Windraider

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    Demun, kokushibo
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    make marksmen be able to strafe in different angles

    make marksmen be able to strafe while moving

    give marksmen a jaguar mount
     
    • Great Work Great Work x 3
  19. TORONTOTOKYO
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    TORONTOTOKYO Windraider

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    12:38 AM
  20. Cak33
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    Cak33 Headless Horseman

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    all it takes was a PB release :)
     
    • Great Work Great Work x 1

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