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Discussion of art selling exemption in T&C

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by PumpkinJuice, Feb 15, 2023.

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  1. OP
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    PumpkinJuice
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    PumpkinJuice Orange Mushroom

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    6:37 PM
    May I know why have you lied about running pink bean being incredibly lucrative? It seems the rewards are so little that it is a drop in a bucket.

    Jk don't take this seriously.
     
  2. Taida
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    Taida Mixed Golem

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    For the time spent it is lucrative, 100m per 1-2 wks isn’t
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  3. yurain
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    yurain Windraider

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    6:37 PM
    YUrain
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    Art seller need to be lv120 first. Does that end the discussion?

    Edit:
    I think OP is questioning, what is stopping a new player to "buy" an art from another source and just sell it for a 100-200m, as a jump start fund.
    Because currently, most RWT bans I saw are like low level characters (<100), probably struggling for their first decent item. What is stopping them from bypassing all these by just buying a 3rd party artist for a few arts, for that initial 200m or something.
     
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  4. iPippy
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    iPippy Nightshadow

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    iPippy
    Effective next patch

    Due to recent insights, I will be placing a pay wall on all my guides and forum posts (because these are art too). If you would like to purchase access after they are taken down, please DM me your ign on discord and duey me mesos in game. If you cannot afford these rates, you are probably too new of a player and should go back to the ghost ship grind or the art cave for funds.

    Rates:
    -Serious thread (non-guide): 30m
    -Serious post: 15m
    -Meme post or thread: 50m (this is where the true artistry lies)
    -Guide: 300m

    I encourage my follow forum novelists to follow the light that OP so graciously showed us and revieve rightful monetary (meso) compensation for OUR lives' works. Just don't forget to pay my 15m royalty if you read this post. :cool:
     
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  5. OP
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    PumpkinJuice
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    PumpkinJuice Orange Mushroom

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    Nov 26, 2022
    6:37 PM
    Isn't pink bean once a week entry? If you are basing off the time to fight the boss, then the time to get the art done isn't that long either.
     
  6. Zorele
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    Zorele Slimy

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    The main issue is that there are just some extreme takes and remaining objective is important. Anyone who says that to the core this isn't "unfair" is completely biased and being unreasonsable. Everyone saying this always ends up being gamebreaking without considering all the limitations is also being unreasonable .

    The fact of the matter is that any external skillset being applied to earn meso you'd assume is against the philosophy of an RMT free server. With that being said, there's many positive aspects to art selling including but not limited to more community involvement. I do think it's something that has to be extremely monitored and as long as it doesn't pose a real problem it can let it be as it is.
     
  7. Joy Celeste
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    Joy Celeste Mushmom

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    Well, they’d have to lie and maintain that they are an artist they _can_ do art for the rest of their maple career (even if they choose to not sell anymore art after the initial commissions). That’s a pretty big lie they’d need to publically maintain forever. Even if you find someone who sells art for commercial use for a good rate, you still would need to lie and say that you did the art yourself here on forums.

    I like the idea of imposing an initial level requirement or other requirement for the seller so that they can’t possibly use this as an initial source of income. Perhaps we can make a rule such that the first work on an art thread has to be free.

    I also like the idea of making all sellers certify that the work they put into generating the art is their own, unless they use AI, in which, they certify they crafted the prompts and dealt with the AI generation process on their own and that they disclose they use AI for whichever works.

    Of course people can still lie, but at least we can ban them the moment we find out it’s RWT.
     
  8. Joy Celeste
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    Joy Celeste Mushmom

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    For what it’s worth in case people are assuming my position: I do feel it’s somewhat unfair for artists to be able to sell art for mesos because it’s not an option to everyone, and that it IS RWT in some way.

    But there are other ways people have advantages in this game: they have more free time. They have multiple computers or perfect internet. Just having a Windows computer to play on over a Mac is an extremely big advantage. All unfair? Yes. But life is sometimes unfair. But we don’t ban these “advantages” either.

    That said going back to this being RWT: I strongly believe the art RWT exception is a good exception to make because it allows artists who choose to create art to be compensated for their hard work and encourages more art in the community. And that it’s not wrong to impose rules to limit the possibility of trading IRL money for mesos. But we shouldn’t take away the ability for artists to be compensated for mesos for their genuine work.
     
  9. Taida
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    Taida Mixed Golem

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    Yes it’s once a week. But I’m saying in terms of the time (and effort) you actually spend, the efficiency value of PB is much much higher.

    In the time it takes someone to create an art piece (let’s say 2 wks), you can run two PBs and have ample time to do even more things that will generate you money. Most of which makes someone spending 2 wks to create something for 100m pale in comparison.

    100m is a nice sum, but 100m in a week or 2 weeks is what makes it a drop in the bucket.

    Also the entry limit is only per character.
     
  10. Joy Celeste
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    Joy Celeste Mushmom

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    (no longer talking about RWT, just real artists selling their work)

    I’m starting to like the initial level requirement of 120 for the seller. With that requirement, anyone could have just made a Bishop and earn 15m/hr from CDs (leech, gach and meso loot minus pots), and this option is always open to non-artists if they want to sell their own skills/time for mesos.
     
  11. beegoratto
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    beegoratto Skelosaurus

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    crab mentality in full effect in this thread
     
    • Agree Agree x 7
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  12. Daydreamer
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    Daydreamer Headless Horseman

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    Art selling is a super nostalgic oldschool activity and it should be allowed on those grounds alone. It's been part of the community (not just ML but MS in general) for a long time and doesn't negatively affect the game.
     
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  13. HimeHam
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    HimeHam Pac Pinky

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    Ah yes lemme set up a RWT scheme and document it on the forums.

    If buyers are willing to pay 100m mesos for an art piece that takes you under an hour that's their problem.

    I'm not biased because I can't draw, and I'm poor! So who's laughing now! (not me)

    I think putting this into rules is kinda weird. I honestly don't think any new player cares tbh. Getting to 120 can be done in a few weeks if somebody wants to put in the time.

    Way I see it is the art is just an extra step / an alibi. A better way I think would be to disguise it as bossing splits or something that doesn't need to be documented on the forums. Then again Nightz is pretty good at his job. He'd catch on if something like this were to happen.

    Introducing my new service: Pay to enter PQ service. I basically place mules into every channel on PQ's and people need to pay me 10m Mesos per entry. MapleF3
     
  14. OP
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    PumpkinJuice
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    PumpkinJuice Orange Mushroom

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    I actually liked your points tbh. You understood that there is a certain unfairness in it, and acknowledges it. I can understand the reason you feel art selling should continue because artist can then be appreciated of their artworks that they genuinely made themselves, which might stem from your pride of your own artworks, is deserving of respect in itself.

    In this thread, many have called me salty, jealous etc. It felt unwarranted as I am just trying to make points about the topic in this thread itself. If I post a controversial topic for discussion, and what I get is attacks and telling me my opinion shouldn't matter because I am new, is this really a friendly and welcoming community? I have read about this particular comment somewhere and I agree with it:

    It is up to you to believe it or not, but I don't hate art selling as much as you think. In fact if I am completely honest, I don't even mind RWT. Many times in original server I played there is RWT going on, even my friends partake in it. When I knew 1 of my friend bought a 2k weapon, I don't go all "Ohh no you shouldn't have done that". I just went jokingly asking him to carry me lucid, or some other hard bosses. Because at the end of the day, it is not competitive, and if the person is willing to spend 2k on an in-game item, well it is up to him since it's his money, I sure as heck not willing to.

    I believe that this server is anti-RWT is because of wanting in-game hardwork for in-game achievements, and very strictly executed the rule that even a streamer buying a follower for 500k gets perma banned. For such a strict view about RWT itself, I just wanted to clarify the fact about why then is a particular skillset allowed? Just because it livens up the community?

    Then if other skills such as what Lin has suggested, should it be allowed then? Because my point is that if art is allowed, why are other skills not? There has to be a clear reason why one thing is okay and others are not.
     
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  15. HimeHam
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    HimeHam Pac Pinky

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    It was never my intention to call you jealous or salty. I'm sorry if I gave off that impression it was not my intention. The forums is a little bit of a septic tank and if you want to meet with the better community they can all be found ingame. In my post I believe I was trying to say that the only people hurt by art sales are people who feel jealous. In the case that you don't mind artselling I don't think it would apply to you, but I'm sorry if I offended you.
     
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  16. Joy Celeste
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    Joy Celeste Mushmom

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    Well, it was more like RWT is very strictly enforced. I'm not saying I strictly agree with a perma-ban due over 500k and a follower, in fact I think that punishment was quite excessive, but the ToS is very clear about what is/isn't RWT and what forms of RWT is legal. The exception was made for art because art livens the community, but the permaban was because ToS was broken, not because GMs were saying 500k for a follower is NOT community engagement. When we play this game we agree to abide by all the ToS rules to the letter, and they're super strict on RWT and say over and over there are no exceptions (other than art, done through proper channels).

    I do think Linny deserves to be compensated for his time if he wishes to sell minutes/custom video content, and forum guide makers too. I never wished to imply that these other creatives shouldn't. Both enrich the community. In fact I think it should be legal to "tip" forum posts with mesos, but I would wait for an exception to be made for it first. However, these transactions, too, should be regulated/public on forums, and they shouldn't be able to be back-paid for existing/past stuff (sorry).

    This has always been legal, it's not against ToS to do this. You can do it if you want but no one will probably pay for it lol.
     
  17. HimeHam
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    HimeHam Pac Pinky

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    lol, it probably falls under some sort of greifing. Not like anyone PQ's anyways so it's p much just a waste of time.
     
  18. Joy Celeste
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    Joy Celeste Mushmom

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    Wait, you mean literally keep 40 clients open in LPQ? That's mad, woman. No one is gonna do that. That is probably griefing. I thought you meant you were gonna sell useful PQer service (thief/mage service for LPQ, MPQ, OPQ etc).
     
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  19. UnknownCode
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    UnknownCode Nightshadow

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    ok wait so, 500mil per toxic funny 4.6bil pay you 15mil.. hmmmmmmm

    so thats 4,585,000,000 mesos to sponsor noobies with !! that sounds amazing to me ok I'm in
     
  20. yurain
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    yurain Windraider

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    YUrain
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    Slightly off topic.
    I was watching the streamer who bought a fame for 150k, then just ask the seller (newbie?) to follow him on Twitch.
    He was banned for rwt on stream, with Nise in the twitch chat itself.
    The streamer verbally questioned chat on this ban, but Nise was only able to ask the streamer to do the ban appeal in the forum.
    I was quite curious if he did get actually perma banned, because this incident is really quite ridiculous/funny to all the viewers in the stream.
    He then did the appeal with the stream clip right after that (I believe he did this one stream as well ???)
    I checked with $maple ign quite regularly during that period of time.
    He appealed and did get unbanned, since I am able to $maple his character again.
    I not sure if he contiuned playing after that incident, because his levels pretty much stagnated after that.
     
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