Update [Beta Test] Challenges System - HP Wash Alternative

I look forward to the @mapowner drama in deep ludi and ellinia-orbis boat

 

Yes. It is irreversible. You cannot opt out once you opt in

Unfortunately no

 

These challenges might be too easy, but I’ll hold judgement until I can do them. I know it’s a level 100 challenge but my 300 int Marksman would have been able to finish it at level 120 in about 15 seconds. I don’t recall the sort of damage I was doing at level 100 but this challenge couldn’t have taken more than 10 minutes. Given this is meant for players who are unwashed, they can easily finish these in no time.

The class-specific challenges are way too easy compared to the global one which looks like a really long grind (3+ hours).

If you participate in the beta are you locked into challenges when they’re actually released?

 

I’ll give my thoughts about this on what I think about this first tier on paper since I don’t think my opinions will change much.

• Is it too easy? Is it too complicated? How do you find the difficulty?

I think the first tier should be deliberately very simple so it can serve as an introduction to the system. In this regard, this first tier is good.

Though I will say 10000 deep ludi monsters might be a bit overkill for level 100 players. I’ve done evil eyes every day for like a week before with the 999 quest and even with the absurd spawns it can take a long time for single target classes. And the spawns and monster hp in deep ludi are much worse than evil eye cave. Considering there are 8 more tiers after this and the initial reward is small it might be better to ease it with the grind. These kinds of grindy challenges are better reserved for level 120+ challenges in my opinion.

I will also say that the class specific challenges seem a little generic for this first tier. As a “challenge” I would expect it to be something that actually encourages you to play the game in a novel or interesting way. Everyone will use strafe or lucky 7, especially when they have to kill 10000 deep ludi mobs. And as this is intended for unwashed attackers this challenge could be done in 20 minutes realistically. It seems disproportionately easy compared to the global challenge.

As I said earlier, since this is the first tier this is all okay. It just wouldn’t make for a good trend going into later tiers.

• Is it not inclusive?

I’d say as is, it is inclusive to 95% of players. I’m sure the staff has already seen the thread regarding beginners and oddjobs being unable to participate which I still hope can be addressed in the final version. Other than that, players who were washing previously but want to change their mind after hearing about the system may have difficulty participating while gathering the 100-200 APRs to reset their stats.

My personal hope is the class-specific challenges get reworked or removed entirely. Partly to increase inclusion, but also because it’s restrictive in what skills you add into when you are playing your character. For example, I would not want to do this on an outlaw because burst fire sucks so bad and I would never spec into it until it’s required for rapid fire in 4th job since you lose access to double shot.

• What combination of mandatory + optional challenges do you think would be appropriate?

The current system as laid out looks solid. Though I don’t really understand the purpose of the special challenges yet.

• Any suggestions on numbers (such as damage dealt) or general feedback is greatly appreciated!

Damage dealt needs to be way higher, probably 5x-10x more at least. You don’t need to go easy, this is unwashed attackers we are talking about. You will be dealing damage at basically any point you are playing MapleStory.

Other than that it looks like a good system on paper. More interesting challenges would be cool in the later tiers, and it could be more inclusive, but otherwise I don’t have any criticisms.

 

tfw the strat for level 100 challenge is still to get leeched to 120 so you can unlock your 4th job skills first

 

One of the challenges should involve ores or something newbies get a lot of. I was really struggling to make ends meet when I started and it would be cool if there was something higher level players wanted from me other than fame

 

The concept is really cool and I could imagine there are gonna be some very unique challenges in the future.

I would change the Nearest Town Scroll and hair changing challenge. I personally think they seem more like a filler of sorts to make the challenge take a bit longer and are closer to annoying or a chore, rather than being fun, unique or difficult (granted HP washing still takes the cake for being the most annoying).

That’s the only feedback I can think of for now! Can’t wait to check them out!

 

While you’re probably correct, I think it would make more sense thematically to require the use of a skill one can actually utilize at that point in time, seeing as this is the level 100 challenge after all.

This passage by xiaoyaoz further indicates that it’s the approach they wanted to take. Perhaps dealing X amount of damage with elemental charge Y would be a better approach, since WKs generally just use slash blast til they’re a few levels deep into their 4th job.

 

but anyway, for warrior is always better wash normal than challenge

 

Now, what if they did something like ask you for 50 Zakum Diamonds or 200 Pianus Scale

Kekw

 

10k deep ludi monster is like almost 3 whole levels' worth assuming you're doing it at level 100

I guess it gives an excuse to grind, if nothing else

 

this is a good approach in tackling the problems of hp washing but realistically, i think that only casual players will prefer this challenge over the traditional hp washing route. that, or veterans who are looking to make a quick character without spending money on leech and/or time on saving up nx. i do not think anyone would be willing to "main" or "invest" in a character that is subpar in terms of their hp.

as someone who is new to the server, forcing myself to be reliant on hb for content of my level and requiring hb for pb even when i'm 200 is not ideal. i would rather create 12 accounts now for each of the classes to vote daily and come back in 3 months when some of my characters have enough nx to start washing, than to create a subpar character that constantly require hb.

while the intent of preventing players from abusing this challenge system to reach 30k hp is good, perhaps there could be a better way to prevent this than just simply locking ap into hp/mp.

instead of locking the ap, i suggest significantly reducing the hp gain/mp lost per ap reset after accepting the challenge route. for example, instead of gaining 16 (16-20) hp and losing 12 mp for a thief when using an ap reset (adding a fresh ap), their formula could be modified to gaining 8 (8-10) hp and losing 6 mp instead. this way, players who opt for the challenge route will not result in a subpar character as they can continue to wash, albeit at a slower pace. at the same time, it does not make achieving 30k hp easier for them.

here is a rough visualisation of the idea in terms of hp and ap resets required. the hp values are not definite and are just used as an example.

 

I dont agree with the part of easy hp for ranged, the challenge dont is to replace hp wash since its unfair to warrior for example.

but use this part of wash give less hp to who do challenge can be Nice, agree on It

 

There’s nothing stopping you from doing this.

 

Can you make it so that paladins don't lose their elemental charge buff after using charge blow?

 

Will doing the challenges lock you out of MP washing? Will doing the beta challenges lock you out of HP/MP washing?

 

Why do we need the class specific challenge when the general challenge is probably the "toughest" one already. I believe the class challenge would already be done if you are actively trying to do the general challenge. I can see it as an anti-leech component that you need to deal damage and not hang on a rope. Why not just make it a non-leechable one?

Less things, so it is easier to manage and less complains on small balance issues?

 

Just a thought, keep these challenges ongoing to maintain the need to continue to work and maintain that bonus health, not just for 1 time challenge rewards for a permanent hp gain.

 

Will there be a ‘class’ specific quest for Permabeginners too?