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Respect.

Discussion in 'Community' started by Aero, Nov 30, 2016.

  1. Aero
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    Aero Skelosaurus

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    So, since I left Legends to search for other places, people and new adventures on Maple. I've noticed a pattern that follows all of the other popular servers I have joined.

    The pattern is that their community usually sucks hard, is toxic and is an honest disappointment to even consider myself a part of.

    From the first week I played here to now, this has been #1 in my eyes.
    It made me feel the need to post here over a year down the line Congratulating the Staff & Players on having such a fucking awesome community.

    Thanks a lot for everything guys ^^

    [​IMG]
     
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  2. Kimmy
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    Kimmy Administrator Staff Member Administrator Game Moderator

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    There's a lot of pattern too as I lurk them. Some people are still shocked by the amount of lurking I do in other servers.

    The reason why I lurk other servers is to learn new things. Its to understand what the other people want; to find out why they want play said server, and if there's something to improve it eventually here. However, its also to learn what not to do, what the downfall is for some of these servers, etc.

    The true fact for one of them is that people like hypewipe. There's for sure one group of people/market that spy non-stop 24/7 on GTOP to find a new server that is just starting. Once they find one, and the rates is 4x+, they will join it and wait the wipe. Everytime when a wipe happens on a said server, people 'try' to advertise it here and try get people to join. Usually the results is positive, but after a week-2 weeks the population goes down again - the wipe hype is over.

    Usually when the population goes down there's that 1-2 special cupcakes that non-stop say 'this server is dying do something' which further damage the pop. The person complaining over and over is actually the one causing the said damage, and same happened here at Legends when quitters started to complain over and over and be negative here *cough cough you know who you are*

    What I said for long time is that there's not a lot of people that like low rates. This will stay fact; there's not a big market for low rates. Managing a low rate server is not easy, since people very easily just join one which is much quicker since they don't have 24/7 of their life anymore like old days.

    The good side of this is what this thread is about. The more matured people and experienced people (in my eyes) do in fact like low rates, which is why the community here is very tight and mature, BUT small due to previously mentioned reasons.

    Yes, I prefer a smaller more tight community. However, I am also aware that more users means a more healthier economy, or people that can PQ right away. Obviously I would love the community to be bigger than it is now, but I don't want 'force' the community to be bigger in exchange of a less quality community. If the community were to be toxic, those that actually make this place fantastic will quit as well, which cause the server to downgrade even further from the quality. That's also usually in those other servers. They are overpopulated by competitive people, people that are more serious, and people that usually have a very high ego.

    Some like those people, some don't. Some do in fact get very motivated by such people (they feel challenged to improve/get better then the person with the high ego). However, that's usually not so for the casuals.

    So yes, I still love this place and there's a lot of people saying 'Kim is giving up on the server' and similar comments. The reason why I am not much in-game lately is because I am actually working on the server, on more content together with the team. When I am too much in the FM I feel distracted by the amount of talking I can do with the community. Once again because the quality of said community is so good.

    Quality over Quantity.
     
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  3. OP
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    Aero Skelosaurus

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  4. xquzion
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    xquzion Capt. Latanica

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    #bringbackHORIZONboyz
     
  5. Kimmy
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    Kimmy Administrator Staff Member Administrator Game Moderator

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    I want to clarify one thing

    I just want to add here that constructive feedback is NOT complaining to me. While it could be seen as complaining, that's not how I see it. Complaining I more refer to the less disrespectful negative feedback, which is not constructive feedback. Just want to add this here for those that left negative constructive feedback in past and felt offended by the statement. Constructive feedback is good. Shouting, trolling, raiding, and be offensive to the Administration or Staff members isn't.
     
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  6. Lionheart
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    Lionheart Horntail

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    I agree a lot with what you say, Kimberly. Especially the part about how we want quality players and don't want toxicity.

    So it still confuses me how when someone gets scammed, you usually side with the scammer. You disabled defame, you removed sacks, you even obliterated Kappa from existence. And yet, you don't like to go out of your way to reverse an unscrupulous transaction you have record of. What is worse are the trolls that like to come out of the woodwork and belittle those who strive for what's right.

    The community can always improve. Food for thought.
     
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  7. Kimmy
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    Kimmy Administrator Staff Member Administrator Game Moderator

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    The scamming thing I can only imagine being a very old case, and I think I know which you refer to. Of course over a year and half later things has changed, and some opinions of mine has changed too. In end Legends is the first 'big' server I manage by myself, so things that may happened at begin may not happen now, or things that didn't happened back then do happen now.

    For scamming it is and still is now required to have proof. For that 'very old' case there was no proof. We had a few more scams a while back which was also related to giving items or dropping items in FM. For one, dropping an item and someone else picking it up is NOT scamming nor is it against the rules. For the former there's proof required from the scamming. I am not commenting if my opinion would have changed or not if the same scam as long ago happened again.

    Defaming got disabled because its literally a 'downvote' button on a game. In GMS it was used to defame hackers, but there's no such thing here. So in any Private Server its to show disapprove for the user, and 90% of time people go on multiple accounts and mass defame the user, which causes more drama. And the only purpose it had is some people collecting defames, which is about 1~3 users. Therefor the negatives favors and so it has been disabled, by default.

    For sacks you already knew back then what happened, and this is also the reason why it has been disabled, together with fact it was only used to kill people they don't like. Similar reasons as defaming.

    P.S: This is off-topic, so this can't be a long discussion.
     
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  8. Hyoon
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    Hyoon Zakum Retired Staff

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    I agree with Cal in that respect. I've created a lot of strong bonds with people and having the opportunity to meet them in person too.

    However I feel like you think ego = instant toxicity. Egos spice up life, or else it'd be boring and dull. Though people hate to admit it, the server was a lot more interesting and fun with Project still actively playing. Drama is everywhere and it cant be controlled, but toxicity can. Warnings and severe punishments can deal with toxicity easily. People with Egos drive people, they give ppl2pass meaning and goals to reach.

    The server population and the low rates hurt the server more than it should. High levels provide boss drops to lower levels in exchange for money, while low levels exchange gach and etc to high levels for money. A system where desired items appear once in a blue moon is extremely unappealing to those who strive to be better. Boss drops mean little to nothing while item forging parts are extremely scarce.

    I've always said to people who ask for suggestions of servers if you want an amazing but small community legends, if you want end game possibilities anywhere else. It's kind of sad because this is generally what legends is, it's a casual server. You come into the server to finally realize end game gear is nearly impossible to achieve (ws + 10), while being unable to play the game for months due to harsh nx restrictions and the need to wash.

    It's a worrying trend, if anything happens to key members of the server (everyone knows who they are) the sheep will follow and the server will break. This is almost guaranteed with tight knit communities, a server that stays together will leave together. This can be seen thru Project, Horizon and such guilds.

    If I see legends continuing to grow it would have been a few things;

    1. Listening to the community; let's be honest I posted a thread regarding boss agro but it was brushed off and never taken care of. I'm not sure if it's a lack of maple knowledge or just laziness but it's pretty huge for the high level community. It not only effects general bosses but seduce too (rip all the se mules).

    2. Accepting that quantity can be > quality. Having a goody two shoes server is nice, it creates less problems and arguments as well as friction. But at the cost of the overall game play. Waiting weeks on end for stuff to show up in the fm is disgusting, and can easily make people give up. Having a villain livens up the server, it creates competition, eagerness to pass the person, and goals to achieve. Toxicity can be agreed upon as a bad thing, but that's what gms are for to control the balance. They regulate the server and serve the community and settle confrontations.

    3. Given each segregation of players an equal chance to shine; This is just casualstory much like habo hotel or club penguin; mini games then chatter. You have to accept that maplestory is built to satisfy over achievers and casual players. Limiting the players effectiveness to wash (it takes 2 years of pure washing to get 11k base on ranged, which is needed for pb). With the current state of a most players HT is the final Frontier. All other bosses that could be available is impossible due to the limitations of both items and washing. Finding the right balance is what you need.

    I really hope that legends grows, it was my first home after all.
     
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  9. OP
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    Aero
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    Aero Skelosaurus

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    Drama helped this server grow a shit ton in the early days, the server was legitimately split in half for a few months. Silver linings lads.
     
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  10. Kimmy
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    Kimmy Administrator Staff Member Administrator Game Moderator

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    No. I actual admire people that are a bit of ego, and proud of their work. For specific groups they started to shit post in shoutbox and tell other guilds they suck. That's a huge difference and to me that's being toxic. To me if you want to be respected and everyone to praise you, you can be proud of your work. However, if you tell that every other guild sucks or everyone else sucks, then that respect is gone.

    So, no. Ego = not toxic.

    If some of them were a bit more respectful to us and the community I would agree. However, the fact that 1 of them very recently streamed and basically told every Legends watcher to move to the server they are playing now I only got more annoyed. Some of them bug abused, and got unbanned. However, even though this said member is super incredible lucky to be unbanned by a rule he did ACTUALLY violate, he still tell users to move to the server they play now. This is extremely disrespectful to us, and make me no longer want him, or anyone that is similar here. Sure, I don't mind new elite people, but not them. They can stay where they play now. The drama that happened after the rule violation and the many emotional lies in attempts for people to feel bad for them only annoyed me more over the months. No, thanks.

    This is more a thing I hear often, and heard a lot too when people heard Maple Weapons is event only here. Yes, Legends is not like every other server. That's what makes it unique. There's so many servers out there that is full of perfect weapons. Perfect weapons was unheard of in the real GMS, only a few people actually had it, and this was when White Scrolls were introduced. The thing with Legends will always be that it tries/tried to be GMS. Getting perfect weapons wasn't part of end game in GMS, since it was pretty much impossible. Its a thing that grew up in people due to being spoiled in Private Servers.

    Washing is similar. For washing people had to pay thousands of dollars to be able to wash. I agree however that being limited on how much you can wash a day is not a perfect system. By limited I refer to fact you can ONLY wash twice a day, and there's not a single way to speed it up by any means. That means you are forced to wait and wait and not being able to spend time on the game to speed it up. However, I still don't think washing should be easier - again it was only a few people in GMS that had 30k HP.

    I agree. People follow, and that's how these wipe servers keep grow massively the first couple weeks.

    We looked into this in past and were not fully being able to pin point the problems yet. Agro will most likely be reverted eventually.

    While we get more content now for end game, we need to admit something here. This is a v62 old school Private Server. Pink Bean was well made when GMS was already starting really easy and went to the 'the higher the number the better' formula. Things like scissors and such got introduced, and more Pay2win items. Pink bean seems to be always compared in old servers, and Pink Bean can't be defeated because... this is v62. This server isn't made for Pink Bean.
     
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  11. Unlucky
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    Unlucky Mr. Anchor

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  12. Martin
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    Martin Selkie Jr.

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    I know i quit months ago, but i just wanna say one thing.

    KimberlyKimberly (and everyone else too, really) i know you don't like Kelvin, and i understand why, but he isn't project. He isn't the only person in the guild. It might seem like that when he's the only one that streams, and he's the one that speaks out the most and draws the most attention, but that doesn't mean everyone in project is like that. It feels like people look at project as a big bunch of Kelvins, but we're not a big bunch of kelvins. Every guild has its colors and for project, some of the darker ones was shown through complaining in shoutbox and whatever, but we only did that to try to help out the server. Sure it might not have been the best way, but that doesn't mean we're all assholes. My point is that while Kelvin is the face of Project, he is just one member out of many. There's so many nice people in project like Gabe, Jordan, Sandy, Dom, and Franco (and many more that im too lazy to mention soz), and i really hate it when people generalize project as a bunch of assholes, because while some of us are, alot of us aren't, and it really bugs me to see those sweet cupcakes in our guild being labeled as assholes despite being amazing people. As someone who has been in both Halcyon and Project, two guilds who is seen as pretty much opposites and old rivals, i gotta say they are more alike then one might think. They were both nice and warm homes filled with nice people who took care of eachother. Sure Project is alot more tryhard and some of us raided shoutbox here and there, but that's only one of projects colors, and although it might've been the one that outsiders saw the most, it isn't an accurate representation of how project actually is, or what the people really are like. So please. Its okay to dislike people, we all do, but don't look down on a group of people because you dislike one or two of them. Don't judge a book by its cover.
     
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  13. Shaved
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    hiiii :D
     
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  14. Kimmy
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    Kimmy Administrator Staff Member Administrator Game Moderator

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    I have bold what especially is important in your post. People compare each other by how they display themselves in public. Example, we as Staff get back lashed all the time because people don't know how we are behind scene, or what we do behind scene. People just assume we are how we are on the outside, or don't work hard on the server. This is why I am more or less just myself also from the outside, and even more nicer when you get to know me better, since if you are not, people will compare you how you act from the outside.

    I am not here to pull a victim card and be like 'Staff get shitted at a lot too, so deal with it' but when it comes to ways people look upon ourselves, the way people think about the staff would be similar to how people thought about -insert name/guild here-. Its true you can look everything by person, but if multiple accidents happen within a guild or people, then people start to compare it in groups. Example, when multiple staff members got hired from 1 guild, I immediately notice people went 'wow she is bias for x guild and only threat x guild nice' No, I am not biased, it just happens that the people that get recruited are from a guild. This is same way that people compare my choices by a group.

    The point I try to make is that its very important how you are from the outside, that's how people compare you as. And unfortunately people will compare you in groups as well. This happens IRL, this happens in guilds in-game, and this also happens at people that are religion and such, or are a specific race.

    As for the stream incident it actually hurted me quite a lot. If that was Kelvin's goal, then he succeeded. I don't understand honestly why it was the need to do what he did, especially after things were long ago, but I guess sometimes you need to leave another big load of negativity once in while. And unfortunately once again this get seen by the 'group' even though it was just him (and people he was talking with, which I am not sure am who they were), and that's how it is.

    Long story short: If you knew you were an amazing person, and think you've contributed to server, or think you were a nice person, then keep think so. Don't let other people's opinions change that. The most important thing is that you're yourself and don't act like a person that you not are. Be yourself.
     
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  15. Number32
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    Number32 Skelegon Retired Staff

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  16. Latte
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    Latte Headless Horseman Retired Staff

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    While I obviously don't play anymore (though I constantly lurk on the forums and discord) I feel the same as Cal. People join preBB low-rate servers to try and replicate that sense of nostalgia from the old days of MS. Since I befriended Cal (that toxic fucker) and the gang we jump from server to server and we no longer are really trying to replicate that old feeling of nostalgia but we found our self constantly trying to replicate what we had here. We talk about Legends all the time and what fun we had and are always trying to recreate how amazing our experience was. I had a better time during my stay here than I did on GMS. I was such a loner on GMS but legends community made the game for me, allowing me to make bonds greater than those I have in real life. Even with my time on the staff it was truly a blast.

    So for those bonds, the amazing experience, and for always staying true to your vision thank you KimberlyKimberly and staff. MapleF11

    P O S I T I V E V I B E S
    H O R I Z O N B O Y S
     
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  17. OP
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    Aero
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    Aero Skelosaurus

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    I'm only toxic because its how I show my love. I promise #H O R I Z O N B O Y S #P O S I T I V E V I B E S
     
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  18. Jente
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    Jente Brown Teddy

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  19. Latte
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    Latte Headless Horseman Retired Staff

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    Do you have res yet?
     
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  20. OP
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    Aero Skelosaurus

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    What the fuck is a dalmascus? btw got res yet?
     
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