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Allow levels on reverse / timeless items to be reset

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by akashsky, Nov 26, 2020.

  1. akashsky
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    akashsky Horntail

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    Based on another thread where people logged the stats they gained on leveling their reverse / timeless weapons, we know that the odds are weighed towards +0 / 1 attack per level.

    Knowing this, the expected attack of a reverse/ timeless weapon is alot lower than initially thought when we believed that all outcomes had equal probability.

    In order to give players a chance to overcome this unfavorable RNG, I propose we allow levels to be reset on reverse / timeless weapons.

    For example, lets say I have a perfect reverse lampion but only got 1/6 attack on levels.

    I can pay 45 Piece of time to have my levels reset, then my lampion will lose the 1/6 attack it gained on levels and I can try again for a better roll.

    I suggest to be able to do the same with timeless, except having the cost be 45 Piece of time and 3 Rock of time.
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 10
    • Agree Agree x 3
  2. Huiae
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    Huiae Headless Horseman

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    This change will make 5 times easier for aiming perf gears. -2 / -1 / 0 / +1 / +2 => +2 and reset forever.
    of course it'll be awesome to have perf gears but I think, making easier for 5 times is way too much D:
     
    • Agree Agree x 6
  3. Selquin
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    Selquin Headless Horseman

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  4. iPippy
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    iPippy Nightshadow

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    If current rates are to be believed, I really doubt this would be "easy" or even still remotely achievable even factoring multiple level up attempts. To get a "perfect" series of timeless levels would be the equivalent of landing 5 10s in a row (w/o) ws. Even relaxing the perfect requirement a bit at current odds would still be landing somewhere in the order of 2 40%s and 3 10%s with no ws. This just isnt going to happen.

    If current level up rates are to be believed, timeless is vastly overvalued. Rates cant really decrease due to high costs of a bean attempt, but its just simply not worth the many level up attempts on rare, expensive gear to get an item that is even *worth* scrolling. And then never be able to reasonably upgrade due to 0 trade-in value. At least with a resetting option, you can scroll (and even sell) first, level later...
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  5. CervezaSanta
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    CervezaSanta King Slime

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    I'm all for something to fight the layers of RNG you have to go through already in this game.
     
  6. s0mething
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    s0mething Capt. Latanica

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    Can I get a refund on all my boomed perf dragon weps as well? upload_2020-11-26_19-20-46.jpeg
     
  7. Shivering
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    Shivering Wolfspider

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    I agree with the idea but the cost is too cheap. It should be at least 4x the original cost in terms of pieces required to reset the weapon because if you craft you only have a 1/5 chance to get a max att weapon. If it's any cheaper than 4x it gives too much incentive to never craft weapons and just wait for PB drops for a perf weapon and then if you get bad RNG you can just reset the level at a fairly cheap cost.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Creative Creative x 1
  8. Bfitchef
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    Bfitchef Mushmom

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    I agree with you akash but just make a limit 1-2 resets per Wep.
     
  9. Alyosha
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    Alyosha Skelegon Retired Staff

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    Based off of the level-up thread posted elsewhere it's not really possible to make any statistical inference as to how level up stats work, especially with such a low sample size. It's probably too early to bring out pitchforks or to make any assumptions as to how it functions.

    It's been a long time since I've done any stats but hopefully this calculation makes it pretty clear that it's not too uncommon to hit 1/15 on an assumed 1/3 chance, in fact it would be capable of skewing one way or another that far about 1 in 3 times.
    [​IMG]

    At the same time it's neither proof against the hypothesis(that there is a roughly even chance) or for it. As it currently stands it's impossible to make any statistical claims as to how it functions, as the sample size is far too small.
     
  10. Cerulean
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    Cerulean Brown Teddy

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    Without getting into all the details, the z-test you performed is not really appropriate in this context. A nonparametric test (e.g. goodness of fit) to test whether the upgrades are uniformly distributed across +0/+1/+2 would be much more reasonable, and would show fairly convincing evidence that they are not uniformly distributed.

    But I do agree that we can't jump to any conclusions because there may be sample selection effects, i.e. people with bad luck were more likely to respond to that thread, although it's not clear whether a larger sample size would help at all.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. Alyosha
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    Alyosha Skelegon Retired Staff

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    That's good to know, though I am having trouble finding a better test to do on Wolfram Alpha. It's also been close to 10 years since I took AP Stats so I'd probably prefer to leave it in more capable hands regardless.
     

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