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Alternative Possbility to messing with AP reset

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by Noctus, Jul 14, 2017.

  1. Noctus
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    Noctus Red Snail

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    Jul 4, 2017
    11:41 AM
    This was also something I brought up in the "How To Deal with AP Resets" thread, but I figured I'd throw it here to see what people thinks. Note I am also one of the newer players of the server, so veteran players may have different ideas, I'm interested in hearing about them too.

    Reason:
    So, I kinda feel like more than the time problem, people are unhappy with how unforgiving the HP washing system is. I feel like we should address the entire concept of HP washing rather than messing with AP reset prices to accommodate a broken mechanic. I know people are saying that ML should preserve the "old school" feeling and therefore shouldn't be too easy, but I feel like currently HP washing honestly doesn't add to the experience, but rather detract from it.

    So I'm hoping this idea doesn't make it so easy for the new players NX wise that it ostracizes the veteran players, while at the same time make it a little more reasonable for casual players who may possibly be considering playing more try-hard/seriously to at least be able to hit end game.

    Problem:
    The problem with HP washing is that it is, currently, REQUIRED(keyword), for ranged DPS. The long nature of the process also requires you to make a decision about playing seriously or playing casually from level 1 if you want to play a ranged DPS(slightly more flexible for DrK, but same idea). Yes, people should spend time on their character and slowly build them, but it's unreasonable to force everyone to plan out their character from level 1 JUST to hit the bare minimum for the end-game boss.

    Personally I don't particularly care that I have to slowly build my character using NX/Time gated mechanics, the so-called "wait2win" doesn't bother me since Maple story old-school is a long term game anyway. I do dislike the idea that no matter how much you put into it, you still can't even fix your character if you didn't plan to HP wash from the get-go, especially considering the mechanic itself is counter intuitive and honestly feels like a bug Neckson overlooked lol.

    Honestly I'd like to remove HP washing completely, but veteran players put lots of time and energy in to int gears and washing, so eliminating HP washing right now would probably cause tons of backlash, so I say for the sake of less chaos, we keep it. But it should not be a requirement for endgame, but rather a luxury.

    Proposal:
    1). Add a completely separate NX item, that's priced at or above the current AP resets(depending on the HP gained) and gives a small amount of max HP each use. The amount you can gain this way is capped out based on what class you are. The cap should be something that is at or just slightly above the bare minimum people need to do the hardest bosses at a reasonable level for said boss. In the event new bosses are added(pink bean, etc. w/e), the cap rises with them.
    2). Keep the washing mechanic, but maybe increase the AP reset prices by a little. That way people can keep washing for godly 15k HP NL or 30k HP DrK or w/e but it's now a luxury rather than requirement and so they pay a little more for it.

    Of course, some kind of full AP reset should probably accompany this if they decide to roll these change out, so those bowmans with a nice 70 int don't get shafted.

    This is similar to the max HP buff to each class, but this way it also act as a NX/time sink(so people don't just spontaneously gain like a 1k-2k HP), this also allows those people who already washed to get a similar HP buff to "reward" them for the washes they already did.

    Yes, people got the washing part for cheap if they washed before the increase in AP reset price(if it's added), but so what, it would be a luxury at this point and if someone wants it, they are free to repeat the process. This way at least it's not required.

    This ended up way longer than I wanted it to, I'll write a Tl;dr tomorrow prob if ppl actually are OK with the idea...
     
    • Like Like x 3
  2. OP
    OP
    Noctus
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    Noctus Red Snail

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    Jul 4, 2017
    11:41 AM
    Apparently I can't edit my post so...sorry for double posting if it's not allowed ;;

    Tl;Dr

    Current HP washing system is honestly flawed for reasons listed above and probably a few that I'm not considering. Most importantly, it's a REQUIREMENT for certain class rather than luxury(assuming you want to progress at a reasonable rate).

    Fix:
    1) Cash item that boosts HP slightly with each use, up to a cap based on bare minimum required for end game boss, varied by class. Priced at or above current AP reset price for the same amount of HP to act as a NX/Time sink so it doesn't completely fuck up Gacha/NX-based balance, while at the same time allow previously casual players who wish to play more seriously to actually participate in end-game. Maybe capped above a certain level too or something.

    2) Increase AP reset price because it now became a luxury rather than req.


    EDIT Tentative Idea:

    I just thought about it. Maybe instead of increasing the price of the Ap resets, they should stay what it currently is. The above-mentioned cash item will be more expensive, as it should more or less be just a "fix your character that's kinda screwed for end game" rather than "hey look at this nice 1k HP for free".

    It's like 1:30 here iunno.
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2017
    • Agree Agree x 1
  3. Piety
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    Piety (ㆆᴗㆆ)/ Retired Staff

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    Apr 4, 2017
    11:41 AM
    Centaur & Chaste
    I think one of the issue with a suggestion like this is that the repercussions something like that would have on the economy is pretty scary; INT gear and everything surrounding it has always been a huge thing, I'd be scared this could crash the market for them and nosedive the price the gear people worked long and hard for. Those HP scrolls make washing still viable but completely skippable, so the need for INT items will completely nosedive.

    This makes it much easier, and considering the reaction to just a price reduction, I doubt this would pass well with the older players (It pretty much also eliminates the need to spend a ton of time to get the gear needed for it.) The highest levels who are already fully washed probably don't care too much about just adding an extra 1k HP for more NX.

    A ''Full AP Reset'' would completely destroy washing, so I don't think that it's something that's doable; a big point of the wash is to have to eventually remove the INT to get it back to your main stat; a full reset would have to be ridiculously high priced if it was even considered
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  4. OP
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    Noctus
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    Noctus Red Snail

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    Jul 4, 2017
    11:41 AM
    Thanks for sharing your opinions!

    You're probably right about the int gear economy. Honestly, I thought about it while I was typing this up, but I couldn't really come up with a good solution for it -- the market's gonna get hurt from any kind of change tbh other than ones that basically dance around AP resets. I do think this method would hurt the int gear economy, but tbh I felt like that economy was problematic to begin with ;; the price of int gear was unreasonably inflated thanks to HP washing, which hurt new mage players a lot too. This was also one reason I didn't want to eliminate HP washing completely, with this change, it's true the market price for the gears will drop, but there will still be a demand for them for people who wants higher HP above cap(which I believe quite a number of people still do). Hopefully this would put the int gear's prices more in line with the other ones, while veteran players who already invested in those gears can still keep them for use to HP wash for higher HP.

    I guess what I wanted to say was that I don't feel like "getting a bunch of int gears" should be the first step in every new ML player's adventure as it has been. So my suggestion was made so that previous int gear's values depreciate but aren't rendered useless, while new players won't have to worry about it as much unless they want to "be the very best".

    It's true that at the highest level, the extra HP probably won't be much of a difference, but I don't think this method also necessarily hurt the players either -- more HP is always good imo anyway. The suggestion was more or less devised under the expectation that it won't hurt anyone. I do admit that as an unfunded new player with no int gears, I didn't consider the int market as much as I probably should have.

    About the full reset, I didn't intend it to be something to be added to the shop as much as a one time thing, it's more or less a way to help the people who added base int but no longer wanted to wash if my suggestion was implemented.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  5. Snake
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    Snake Brown Teddy

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    Apr 29, 2017
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    5:41 PM
    I'm also not a huge fan of the whole washing system (despite having abused it quite a bit myself over the years). Thing is server has been out for a while now so I don't think it's optimal to add these things so late. So I feel it's probably best to just keep things as is. I do think alternative ways of acquiring AP resets should be considered though.

    IMO an alternative should probably have been figured out from day 1 and washing could've just been patched out right then and there. An example could be higher levelled equipment giving hp bonuses, or a hp increase skill for thieves and bowmen.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1

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