Alternative to Prestigious Coin? Putting expiry on CS/WS without (severely) griefing hoarders

Very interesting variant on what the current system prototype will be going forward for the prestigious coin system. The more suggestions and ideas that are out there to help finetune the system and add discussion the better. I appreciate the time you put into thinking it through. Can't wait to see what staff eventually comes up with.

 

If it doesn't help the boss profit, I can't see why it's that good. Seems this itself is a more relevant cons than any other prestigious coins con. But I agree that prestigious coins will be the new meso and I think it should be taxed while traded.

 

This should solve the WS price for good really.
As I quote kimmy that, we have close to 4 digit of WS in this server.
People are literally hoarding WS (me too honestly) and just driving the price up. Something like everyone just HODL and diamond hand LOL.

We got to solve people just hoarding first, before it can be effectively tackle by supply interversion.

 

The main reason for ws/cs being overly expensive is due to meso devaluation. Making cs/ws untradable or adding a coin system for their exchange wouldn't fix the hoarding issue since people would most likely resort to hoarding other items that don't tend to devalue along with meso, such as gfa 30, perfect elemental wands, etc.
The prestigious coin system would however promote meso sink not only through the exchange tax but also from providing more of an incentive for people to run bosses. If the goal is to fix the hoarding issue, the focus should be in increasing meso sink and meso value, not on gating people from being able to hold on to certain items.

 

On the other hand, it is perfectly ok for someone want to hoard gfa30,elemental wands or even chairs LOL.
There are techinally substitute for them maybe a be inferior but still usable (gfa70,60 / non perf wands).
Why hoarding WS/CS is bad for the game is because it literally cock blocks game progression for all the players, there is literally no way around it.

 

You could make the same argument for other items that people also tend to hoard such as gen30, mw20, gfa 30, cfa 30, oa int 30, etc. Just because they're still relatively easy to purchase does not mean that people won't hoard them as well if they won't be able to hoard ws/cs anymore. The higher an items demand is, the more incentive there will be to hoard it so long as meso inflation continues to exist.

 

Yea, I don't think the prestigious coin system would prevent people from hoarding these items; the exchange tax could help the economy a little bit but people would continue printing meso and buying these items so they don't lose meso from it's inevitable inflation

I think a better alternative would be to "nerf" the 1% of the playerbase that is responsible for 90% of the meso inflation. Increasing mobs vertical and horizontal attack range at ulu1, ulu2, cornians and other very low effort meso farming maps for example, which makes it severely harder to multimage, or nerfing how much you can npc their equip drops for in these high meso maps so farmers are inclined to sell leech, or farm scrolls instead of printing new meso into the economy.

 

Of course, the goal would be to make it more difficult for them through tweaking certain maps. Multi maging requires you to alternate between clients, if a mob's knockback or attack range were to be increased it would make it harder for people to station their mages in a single spot.
Nerfing the amount of meso you can get from equips on the other hand would negatively impact non multimagers but it could serve as an incentive for people to sell leech as a means of making meso instead of farming the 1% of the maps that net them a lot of raw meso.

 

we used to nerf gobies on the basis of the same argument but what not?

 

Goby was already a high effort map, the fact that rarely anyone goes there despite still being one of the best pure meso farming maps shows it, the nerf was originally due to the aggro bug, since then they buffed it back a bit, though it still has 1 fewer bombing fish house.
Ulu 1 is an even better map for farming meso, and ulu2 is almost the same as goby meso wise but it requires significantly less effort. I'm not particularly in favor of a spawn nerf since it affects people farming on a single client almost just as much as multimages, however tweaking these maps as a means of increasing the amount of attention or effort required without having to nerf the spawn would mostly affect multimagers and people who multitask farm all day whom barely have to pay any attention, which would result in less meso being generated.
One good example of would be Zipangu: Ninja Castle Hallway [7] (nintos) where a portion of the floor in the middle warps you to a different map, or Sutra Depository 7F where the fishes knock you back making it hard to stay in a fixed spot; these maps require more attention therefore they're significantly less viable for multimagers and people who spend the whole day farming while they multitask.

 

hmm i think this is an amazing idea, however what if an individual is saving up ws one by one in order to one day hopefully have enough to perfect a weapon or item? that would put them at a disadvantage since now they would have to save all their mesos all at once before buying the WS, whereas before they could choose whenever to buy them (presumably when it's at it's cheapest)

 

THIS IS WHAT IVE BEEN SAYING

WS/CS are in a tricky spot because they are the most desired endgame item, and they are CONSUMABLE. They are an incredibly safe investment and because supply/demand is controlled as a result of more of them being consumed/hoarded than generated, and they are the go-to item used as currency for big trades.

Because their use is so loaded, it kind of fucks over anyone who actually intends to use them as the devs intended. Slapping an expiry on them either forces you to use it, or forces you to put them into circulation.

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The only halfway decent argument I've heard against it as that all current WS/CS would have the same expiry and that there would come a day where the market would be fucked as a result of them all being poofed at the same time. Even the threat of that day will allow people to use that as an opportunity to get a bunch of cheap ws/cs.

However, people who started much earlier on the server have already had that advantage. Remember when WS/CS were sub 100m? That's likely never happening again, and WS/CS "D-Day" would only happen once before fixing the problem forever. Plus, you could randomize the expiry date within a given range, or make it so that the expiry is applied when the account is logged in to so that someone who's been inactive for a year doesn't get fucked over by the change.

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tl;dr I will die on this hill

 

This topic has been discussed heavily if not on the forums on various discord servers. Through these discussions, I think the cleanest solution would be to separate the transition into two parts:

• Turn all existing white scrolls into Legacy White Scrolls that can still be freely traded, used, and stored (does not expire). This supply will continue to be used in three ways 1) as a white scroll 2) as exchange currency 3) as a novelty collectors item. The non-expiry of these items will be balanced out by the discontinued production of these scrolls. Hoarding of these scrolls will eventually become irrelevant to the white scroll market.
• Make all newly generated white scrolls expire after 90 days. This will give those who acquire and do not need white scrolls (at the moment) to offload the white scrolls to others that need them. This creates a healthy flow for white scrolls and shortens the time between their creation and use by setting a hard upper limit of 90 days. This increase in trade will also act as a healthy meso sink as more white scrolls are consumed up.

An argument I've heard against expiring White Scrolls:

• Expiring items cannot be listed in the Free Market stores, so all trades will have to be made through social conventions (smegaing, #free-market, etc.). I don't see this as much of a downside since you aren't coming across multiple white scrolls a week. The market inconvenience does not outweigh the advantage to a superior system, imo.