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Update General Patch Notes: Summer 2025

Discussion in 'Update Notes' started by Kimmy, Aug 18, 2025.

  1. xiaoyaoz
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    xiaoyaoz Game Developer Staff Member Game Developer Balance Team

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    As mentioned, the goal is to hit scalability, if you find anything that is easy to scale then you'll know it will get hit eventually.
    If you have seen what sandpicklesandpickle has commented, seems like we have been consistent with what we are trying to do, perhaps you'll disagree.
     
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  2. Nightz
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    Nightz Supervisor Staff Member Supervisor Game Moderator

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    What kind of answer are you realistically expecting here from a BT member? It should be no surprise to you that scalability has always been something that staff has been fighting against to keep it within bounds or require additional effort. At least that's been the case since I joined the server and as long as I remember.

    I understand that this can definitely feel as a bit of a whack-a-mole situation at times as this is often reactive balancing but as long as you are trying to push the boundaries of the game you will be susceptible of nerfs or adjustments to make it harder, not necessarily impossible. That really shouldn’t come as a surprise.
     
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  3. Subterlabor
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    Subterlabor Horntail

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    Well I ask because even things like single mage petri was nerfed through pot costs, sweeper nerfs. So is 30m/hr deemed not acceptable? Or what's the acceptable income we're allowed to pursue without fear of being punished for it exactly?

    Is it the staffs vision to have a 2200c attempt on facestompers take 19 days of 8 hours/day of Petri leech?
     
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  4. porl
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    porl Selkie Jr.

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    Soon the only way to make progress will be to get spooned on CS & then the lower mental players will all quit
     
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  5. Subterlabor
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    Subterlabor Horntail

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    I want some clarity on what exactly their goals are and how they plan on maintaining any level of playerbase when they carpet bomb their most loyal players every other patch over opinions rather than facts
     
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  6. Subterlabor
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    Subterlabor Horntail

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    Fear not this was a very small list indeed

     
  7. eldes
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    eldes Slime

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    Why do you feel like staff should care about *the* end game item having an insane cost?

    Why should they cater to only 0.01% of the populations needs, who are always pushing the most insane strategy over the needs of the 99%?

    No one is entitled to having a facestomper or attempting it no?
     
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  8. OP
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    Kimmy
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    Kimmy Administrator Staff Member Administrator Game Moderator

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    Will never be not silly when people with the most annoying attitude are the ones being in fear of us scaring people away, when little do they know they contribute to the worst of that. Never changes year after year.

    I get nobody fully agree on all changes that happen. But if you want anyone to take you serious, stop with the sarcasm and stupid meme posts, because I have also said this since the very first year of this server's existence, and you can ask people like Hiyo that have been here for a REALLY long time, if you start to shitpost or be straight up disrespectful to point you get me all of all people annoyed, I really do not care about your feelings. And no, that doesn't mean you should agree with every change or every post, but the more you start get sarcastic, rude, disrespectful, or shitpost, the less I will care about yours.
     
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  9. Subterlabor
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    Subterlabor Horntail

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    I've always admired your fuck you attitude, anyways

    When has balance team actually backpeddled on such a severe nerf to even merit an attempt at an actual conversation? They instead apply their blanket nerfs and ignore anyone who says otherwise

    Half the time they won't even respond, or give a straight answer to begin with until there's so much backlash they're forced to respond. Why are we attacking mages for the 47th time instead of addressing the massive imbalance in classes that they themselves have been contributing to?

    And finally why even have white scrolls, chaos scrolls or facestompers in the game if you don't want anyone to be able to afford them even with hundreds of hours grinding, and billions of meso investing just to make it affordable?
     
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  10. Syrinz
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    Syrinz Game Moderator Staff Member Game Moderator

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  11. Hiyo
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    Hiyo Headless Horseman Retired Staff

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    My age is showing SlimeSweatSlimeSweat
     
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2025
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  12. OP
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    Kimmy
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    Kimmy Administrator Staff Member Administrator Game Moderator

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    "So much to do, so little time" Best to explain everything that is unresolved to this day on this very well crafted game version from Neckson.
     
  13. Subterlabor
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    Subterlabor Horntail

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    Perhaps better time utilization is in order then. My prior questions still stand but to summarize them about not posting memes etc, what exactly is the point? That's the only way they will even respond so we know if we're wasting our time playing this server any longer
     
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  14. OP
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    Kimmy
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    Kimmy Administrator Staff Member Administrator Game Moderator

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    I have heard this very same thing back in 2016. I am going to say this for the millionth time or so in total, but all the staff here are doing everything on their free time and unpaid. And believe it or not, but want the best for the server they are playing on, and more importantly the longevity of this game. As another reminder, this game version is now lasting double the age of GMS did (2005~2010 when Big bang happened) + another year added to it, and is still surviving. I am pretty confidence that if it wasn't for the balance changes we made through the years and if the game was still like how it was in 2015 minus the QOL (I assume we at least all agree QOL is good), than this server would have been completely done for in one way or another.

    But the thing that personally bothers me is that we have already said multiple things many times before, such as balance changes happen and getting reverted is simply because it didn't reach the goal we wanted, which is still the case. It's very easy to say do this or that, and then ask yourself as user why it doesn't get "properly tested", which it does by the way, but we can't simulate fake ping, 1,000+ players playing at once, and retroactive see what x or y change affects the economy or balance, so sometimes changes happen where we need to see actually on a live database (you guys!) how it plays out, and sometimes it just leads to side effects, less than ideal results, or other unpleasant results.

    But I am going say it yet another time, that shitposting is not the way. Sure, you get your one reply and result, but the realistic response you get is a team that slowly gets demotivated on even wanting to do anything at all, which leads to updates slowing down, which leads to the problem you are facing to only become worse. Why, WHY would they want to help the server when the playerbase is only bickering over all the changes that happen? Would you?

    Again, I am not saying "go kneel and be happy with all the changes that happen", I am saying that even if you happen to get response out of your shitposting strategy, the long term results is that you slowly tear the staff team down on wanting to do anything at all.

    Pre-bb Maplestory is just really bad, the game admittedly is already for years on bendaid fixes. The realistic thing is that this game, and especially this game version wasn't made to last 11 years, which is why Big Bang happened to begin with. Neckson knew that this game NEEDED a refresh, and Big Bang did exactly that. Also, any kind of client modification and complete overhaul of any skill or system takes a long time, because as an unofficial server we do not have access to the game's source code, only a compiled binary (the v0.62 client), and thus any kind of very specific overhaul of a job takes a lot and a lot of time, and its only a miracle Davi/Pasta became as good with client modifications as he did over time, because a lot of these things such as complete skill overhauls and adding things like buff timers to the v0.62 client are completely unheard of, and its only thanks to his improving and improved skills on client binary modifications that it can happen at all.

    Then lastly, some modifications are just not realistic on a very old database. I am going to say this again, but I hate leeching, I hate HS, I hate washing as much as everyone else. If I ever restarted a server, it would be a no brainer to not have any of that, because they ARE a bad game design. But, HP washing is NOT logged, so again, removing HP washing now for example is just not possible. HP challenges became the alternative to it, but again its not perfect, but the best we can do on an already established server. And this problem of this server being 11 years old are in different territories as well, so we have to decrease the power of these problems, because removing it completely is just not realistic, and probably never will be.
     
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2025
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  15. Subterlabor
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    Subterlabor Horntail

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    I understand but while staff becomes demotivated, so does all the players. We invest thousands of hours into this game, building infrastructure, investing just to get told time and time again "staff doesn't approve of this method because ???, nerf it"

    We try to pursue our goals for gear, dpm, etc just for staff to come around and single handedly render all of our hours wasted over night. When this happens over and over, all that happens is an ever growing lack of trust among the staff, like us farmers telling DrChuchuDrChuchu how syncing works in good faith just for him to spin it around and use it against us instead.

    At this point even if you reverted this (extremely doubtful) I wouldn't trust staff not to one day render my class worthless overnight, wasting years of my work and efforts. For the casuals this is fine, but for the endgame players who use farming to subsidize our goals we instead see it as doomsday. It was widely accepted that 60m/hr on a multi mage setup was the "safe" spot for scaling, but that's been disproven.
     
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  16. Nightz
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    Nightz Supervisor Staff Member Supervisor Game Moderator

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    Really no need to single out certain staff members, believe it or not but Chu actually had nothing to do with these changes and wasn't the one to suggest them.
    If you don't understand the difference between changes that affect scalability or changes to a class that might "render them worthless overnight" then I don't know what to tell you either.
    Even if we make changes to specific classes as we done in the past, the goal is never to completely kill off their viability...
     
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  17. cat123
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    cat123 Brown Teddy

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    The equips are that expensive due to the ceiling on income strategies, right? Players selling those equips will sell for lower if their buyers (or themselves) can't bring in as much funding.
     
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  18. Mirrors
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    Mirrors Game Moderator Staff Member Game Moderator

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    Fun fact!

    It appears there are 2,214 map files in the game files. (I used lib to check. There are 221 pages of 10 maps each, and 4 extra on the last page).

    Let's say some of the maps are inaccessible for whatever reason, and knock off 214 maps, which leaves us at 2,000 total accessible maps.

    The desync timer only happens to 18/2000 of maps! Aka 0.009, or 0.9% of maps. Truly a small list indeed!
     
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  19. CaptainNemo
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    CaptainNemo QA Tester Staff Member QA Tester

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    If I recall, DGP map was already subject to adjusted spawning, as well as a few others on that list, no?
     
  20. Nightz
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    Nightz Supervisor Staff Member Supervisor Game Moderator

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    That is a very different thing than these changes from last patch. the exact same amount of mobs will still spawn every 10 seconds on this list of maps as before the patch, however you can no longer influence when after a restart of the server. Not in the same way as before at least.
     
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2025
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