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Making HP Washing Truly Optional - a Solution

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by Skuire, Apr 25, 2021.

Do you think implementing this system would be good for the future of MapleLegends?

  1. Yes

    251 vote(s)
    83.4%
  2. No

    20 vote(s)
    6.6%
  3. Maybe

    30 vote(s)
    10.0%
  1. xadra
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    xadra Windraider

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    Lol, this is not "everyone else". Dogpiling someone doesnt make you right like in an elementary school playground. If I was -ovv i wouldnt die on this hill because like someone else said washing is like politics and people, especially uninformed people come in with minds made up.

    If anything the most experienced players are all pretty much aligned with what he thinks but we recognize the futility of fighting this tidal wave of unexperienced players who just want to let loose their frustrations and are mostly ignorant about the true intricacies of washing.

    Also reminder that many of the older players have made it known (esp earlier in the thread when things were...calmer) that they support Sku's suggestion, and -ovv is here being a necessary devil's advocate discussing the exact details of when and how it should be implemented. The side effect of this is that the new players (especially those playground bully style people who go "you're outnumbered just give up") immediately rush him like grandmas on black friday morning because it's an easy target and puts a face on those mythical "older players who gatekeep content and mUh NOZstAlGiC gAEm."

    I'll add another point which has always been my opinion on wash: you guys keep going on and on about how washing kills so many new players. Probably true. But you guys also ignore the droves of new players who DO in fact stay on (and if you've been here for long, you know how common this is) and stay just fine in the server. This is seen by how we've been #2 on gtop for 3, 4 years by now. Those "neo-liberal" no-wash servers, where are they placed really? How's their player retention? Numbers speak for themselves really.
     
    • Agree Agree x 6
    • Disagree Disagree x 2
  2. -ovv
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    -ovv Horntail

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    -ovv
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    I'm only here for the memes. This is precursory entertainment before the Anniversary Balance Patch changes come about.

    [​IMG]
     
    • Great Work Great Work x 4
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  3. xadra
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    xadra Windraider

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    Then we can all go back to raging about paladin and I/L nerfs like good civilized people instead of this caveman washing stuff
     
    • Like Like x 2
  4. fael
    Online

    fael Headless Horseman

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    8:57 PM
    Fael
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    But what's the problem with this?
    I mean, probably those new players would stay with or without new ways to gain HP.
    If you agree that "probably" there are new players quitting (I'm sure about it) for the hp wash thing, then we must find something good, even if it's something different of what was suggested here.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  5. xadra
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    xadra Windraider

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    My point is changes come with costs. Which is why we need to be discussing the nuances of implementing it and questioning the long term consequences. And not to spam disagree and go all mob mentality on the first person to bring it up.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  6. -ovv
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    -ovv Horntail

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    Stuff like this is why balance team applications need to be public. I’m curious as to what kind of applications staff has to go through.
     
  7. fael
    Online

    fael Headless Horseman

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    Yeah, I totally agree with you.
    I just think there are people (and I hope this isn't interpreted as critical to any specific person here) who aren't accepting any changes because they've managed to do something that many aren't willing to do.
    I would like to know if people who disagreed with the suggestion are against new ways to gain HP or are against that suggestion specifically. Maybe I will do a poll later.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
    • Like Like x 1
  8. RegalStar
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    RegalStar Nightshadow

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    I'm more curious as to what the people who actually got on the team has to go through, after witnessing both Alyosha and Joota leaving only a few months after joining.
     
  9. OP
    OP
    Skuire
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    Skuire Nightshadow

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    01302013.png
     
    • Informative Informative x 9
  10. Oradious
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    Oradious Capt. Latanica

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    Oradious
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    What's so bad about players quitting? People come and go for various reasons, which may or may not include HP washing. ML isn't a one-size-fits-all server. Some people prefer high rates, no wash or even post BB. ML clearly isn't that. Look at what happened to the server whose name sounds like a French pastry when they tried to cater to a larger audience. People have mismatched expectations when they hear "old school v62 nostalgic server", because the information and meta isn't the same as it was in 2008, and not a lot of people got past 3rd job back then.

    Plus, the skill level of an average HTer is already diluted enough. Why dumb it down further with complainants who just seek instant gratifaction?
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 3
    • Like Like x 1
  11. lv1crook
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    lv1crook Capt. Latanica

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    Is this suggestion really in any way instant gratification? It would take months of questing to reach your HP goal, not to mention the time you spend grinding to get to that level. Except if you are leeching all the way, in which case, why wouldn’t you wash in the first place? This would take more brainpower than pressing spacebar on your bishop until you can press spacebar on your NL
     
    • Agree Agree x 6
  12. Esmo
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    Esmo Pac Pinky

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    Hes not wrong tho
     
  13. akashsky
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    akashsky Horntail

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    Going back to the original suggestion, I think that it would be fine to make the quest something really quick and easy (~15 mins or less) but make it require 1 ap reset to start.

    So then after doing the quest, you gain enough mp for an hp wash (at the cost of 1 ap reset + some time doing the quest). Then, you need to spend another ap reset to convert the mp into hp. At this point I would say that the effort to gain HP via the quest is similar to the effort to gain HP via normal washing, and it will also be similar in nx cost.
     
    • Creative Creative x 8
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Useful Useful x 1
  14. pharaoh
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    pharaoh Master Chronos

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    If you want to do HT without HB you barely need to wash. As long as you use the appropriate HP equips (BFC, MoN, pet equips, event equips), it doesn't take much base INT to cross 10k (which is the bare minimum for HT). I did it with only 20 base INT. And imo expecting to toad or PB without HB as a baseline on a ranged character (would need 15k+ hp) would be unreasonable. Not to mention but if this gets implemented, people have even less of a reason to make DK, which would be a shame.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  15. eliyuh
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    eliyuh Mushmom

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    I don't think anyone should rely on event equips unless they're tradeable and permanent, otherwise new characters who weren't here for an event like that wont be able to get them, and players that do rely on them already will eventually lose them.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
  16. -ovv
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    -ovv Horntail

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    Why would new players need HP gear for end-game content? If you haven't noticed, the HP rings tend to cycle event after event. When one set of rings expire, another event comes around so they can farm them as well.
     
  17. pharaoh
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    pharaoh Master Chronos

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    I agree, but it is an option for someone who is hell bent on having 4 INT and still feeling entitled to do all of the content in this game without HB on a ranged character without sacrificing any damage or having to wear HP equips (face mask, eye access, etc.) which in an ideal world should have drawbacks, given the trend that event equips get cycled each event.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  18. eliyuh
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    eliyuh Mushmom

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    I agree 100%, I don't think any ranged should feel entitled to do all bosses without HB unless they put tons of effort into washing. Otherwise HB would be pretty useless.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Like Like x 1
  19. bluelight
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    bluelight Dark Stone Golem

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    i think that the quest cost only 1-2m a day is not fair.
    The reason is that int gears are extremely expensive.
    Old players they have to buy int gears or they have to scroll it
    Players have to add a lot of int.
    => Therefore 1-2m is such an easy way to play
    How about the market, people who sale int gears?
    In my opinion players who play easily in the start, they have to do more effort in the end, the cost of the Q should be 10m/ a day.
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 3
  20. bluelight
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    bluelight Dark Stone Golem

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    Another problem I think is that:
    If I know about this quest, I can speed up HP washing alot
    For example:
    You can only receive this quest if your Maximum Potential HP falls below a certain threshold.
    The amount of base HP required to effectively engage in all endgame content on MapleLegends, EX: ~9.5k for Thieves

    Like the writer said, If I am a Thief I just need to keep my hp under 9.5k and I can have additional Mp by +int or (int gear), and I can do this quest everyday => Players can do both hp washing and quest, it can be speed up easily.
     

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