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Information November 2023 Balance Changes [Explained]

Discussion in 'Update Notes' started by Nise, Nov 26, 2023.

  1. brunandes
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    brunandes Windraider

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    1:12 AM
    That is true, but those below average tma mages were already weak af compared to the other classes prior to this change. Now they get weaker? Doesn't really make sense to me.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  2. Huiae
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    Huiae Headless Horseman

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    2:12 AM
    Verdict
    Bishop
    WeenieHutJrs
    This is sad point, but in realistic, who loves mage even try to boss using it, gears their magechar well and mostly are above 'that hurdle' already.
    Remember that this isn't applied on ULT which most of mages care for their farming THANKSFULLY.

    Your concern is true only in scenario likewise low-tier geared mage attending boss, which actually isn't realistic imo, in this server. so we should be fine :)
    Still sad to see instant dmg reduce but let's see positive side, likewise, now mage players have potential to be greater as they put their effort on their chars.

    Now mage players can white pepega attackers and bully them saying 'you're useless even more than me'
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2023
    • Agree Agree x 1
  3. brunandes
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    brunandes Windraider

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    1:12 AM
    I haven't really look in depth into the formula, and they did not provide examples of what 'moderate gear' means. Fwiw i used to do low lvl bosses like rav, pap, bf when my IL was 13x. If their definition for 'undergeared' mage is the same for a lvl 200 and a lvl 130, the lvl 130 mage will be severely punished, which is rather unfair.
     
  4. Huiae
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    Huiae Headless Horseman

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    WeenieHutJrs
    Ye.... that's the part which I feel bitter taste aswell. hoped it goes 'buff for every mages' because mage single target dpm was terrible anyway (let's not consider crazy mages like edann or nightz, oradius, that's their game, not ours lmao) so we can be happy together but seems balance teams opinion wasn't same with me sadly.

    Also, new formula guarantees 'significant reward for your investment on mage char' unlike current one, I think that's good side.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2023
    • Agree Agree x 1
  5. Tobi3
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    Tobi3 Slime

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    Nov 22, 2023
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    9:12 AM
    For someone washing their mage, this new change is time-gating the DPM of a mage. Levelling without +5 TMA from somewhere, actually decreases damage with those skills. What?
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
  6. Jean
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    Jean Windraider

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    1:12 PM
    Jean
    Beginner
    32
    Funk
    what indeed.

    indeed
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2023
  7. brunandes
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    brunandes Windraider

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    1:12 AM
    Just looked again at the example provided, it is actually a significant nerf to lower lvl mages wtf? A lvl 120 mage even with 850 tma gets punished... seriously this change is going to harm a lot more people than it benefits.
    I have been all for AM buffs, but staff really seem to have dropped the ball here.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2023
  8. GooBeR
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    GooBeR Chronos

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    9:12 AM
    Mage ultimates are unaffected. If a 120 mage is using their other fourth job skills they deserve to be punished.
     
    • Agree Agree x 5
    • Disagree Disagree x 2
    • Informative Informative x 2
  9. Huiae
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    Huiae Headless Horseman

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    WeenieHutJrs
    But I haven't see any lv.120 mage instantly put 1 point on Par/CL/AR and try 'bosses' with it. (it barely hits few thousands dmg per line iirc even with previous formula) and you should be OK when you actually max those skills After maxing ults being funded thanks for mage's nice farming ability. Ofc, if you were adventurer who was willing to boss having your magechar w/ lv.120, only 1 point on your bossing skills, you're completely destructed, but in realistic, I think it's not TOO bad like we're scared of.

    fyi - this was same with attackers anyway. at lv.120, it's lv.1 TT which does almost same dmg with maxed L7, it's lv.1 brandish which does almost same dmg with power strike (even worse considering longer skill delay), and so on.

    no worries, you'll be readied when you max bossing skills, if you gear your magechar properly following your progress. I see their intention here. 'Gear it up if you wish to do bosses, instead of just coming naked relying on only lvl/base int, result should reward you better than current'.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2023
  10. brunandes
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    brunandes Windraider

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    1:12 AM
    Why deserved to be punished? It was fun to put 1 point in paralyze/chain lightning to finally do some dmg compared to 3rd job. Now you get a 40% reduction in your already lowest among all classes damage, thanks alot eh.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  11. brunandes
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    brunandes Windraider

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    1:12 AM
    I rmb putting 1 point in CL just to do the blizzard quest because it requires killing grim phantom watch lmao.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  12. TORONTOTOKYO
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    TORONTOTOKYO Windraider

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    1:12 AM
    great buff to mages. make int great again. i need to sell my stuffs
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  13. Taima
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    Taima Mushmom

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    5:12 PM
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    <85 IQ Mapler here, with some thoughts.

    These mage changes come with some unintended side-effects for oddjob (gish [combined str/int/luk] and gishlet [combined str/luk]) mages, desecrating these selected skills to total uselessness. I understand that the changes are made with actual mages (INT/LUK mages) and to a greater extent, the pure INT bathrobe-wearer in mind. That's not an issue, but I don't think that a level-up should make a mage or any character become weaker, even if they decide to do something dumb like add all their AP into DEX. I worry that if a similar change were made to other skills, there would be no room for funky builds - yeah, I know, slippery slope argument here in full force. I'll leave this one to the scholars who care enough to debate or have a better alternative in mind (separating INT and Magic Attack seemed like a darn cool idea).

    I dislike these sorts of changes made purely for time-saving. Why fix what isn't broken? Cast out the urge to create EasyStory, we're here to play MapleStory! This game should be tough and full of inconveniences! I've had some really nice chats while gathering Lip Lock Keys and doing other inconvenient BS in Maple, and I hope this server doesn't stray too far from the inconvenient mess that we all love. I sort of wished that I had criticized many of the prior quality-of-life changes that directly affect gameplay, as each one is an imperceptible tiptoe away from the version of Maple that I actually want to play. I'm just one user in a sea of players held captive by our sunk time and progression in MapleLegends, and don't expect the server to cater to me.

    I feel like this cuts into the theme of APQ. This is a PQ based on marriage and romance, which are pretty heavily gendered. Party composition will be a little easier, but I'm going to miss parties calling for a specific gender to join their PQ. This also adds an invisible and convoluted set of rules to the PQ that new players won't be familiar with. I worry about future changes cutting away parts of PQs that I really liked, and replacing them with weird toothpick and gum custom creations. That's right, slippery slope again, baby. At least we can now do a full gay or lesbian APQ, and that's worth something.

    If I remember correctly the APQ couples' stage was still broken before this patch. I never got to even try because everyone said it was still broken, does this mean it's fixed? MapleF2 if true.

    Does this include Booster and Speed Infusion, if they are cast before entering the bonus? Weapon speed factors in pretty heavily as well.

    I'm actually really going to miss having the composition of the party actually matter in the bonus. It was kind of nice getting Haste or SI and having better box-bashing abilities thanks to my party members. I never had an issue watching Hermits/NLs flash jump all over the place either, and they would usually take the boxes that the rest of us couldn't reach. It was unfair, and it was awesome. The change isn't a nerf to NLs in any way that matters, but it makes the game just a tiny bit more sterile, and further off the mark from the actual game MapleLegends was derived from.

    I'm not trying to be too harsh here. I'm excited to play, and cautiously excited for future PQ reworks. Happy three-days-after Thanksgiving! SlimeSweat2
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2023
    • Agree Agree x 4
    • Like Like x 3
    • Friendly Friendly x 2
    • Great Work Great Work x 1
  14. Disney
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    Disney Red Snail

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    1:12 AM
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    For the cwk bonus, would the spawn points be readjusted? Or will it be the same(spawn at left door). If so wouldn't those who have rolled the right side boxes be at a slight disadvantage with the decreased move speed to be able to clear boxes in time?

    Usually this wouldn't be a problem when it's 5man but some people already have issues clearing all boxes with haste and si
     
    • Agree Agree x 6
  15. Aimerrhythm
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    Aimerrhythm Horny Mushroom

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    1:12 AM
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    thanks nise
    i just have an end game IL
    let me carry you all!
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 2
  16. Tommygunner
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    Tommygunner Mixed Golem

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    12:12 PM
    overall, amazing changes. thank you staff.

    i am sad noob mages got nerfed but overall, i think its the right direction to buff mage single target skills.

    thank you for reducing signs on cwkpq. I have many friends who didn't have many signs, and now they don't have to worry. also thank you for making looting better and not have things fall off.

    i am concerned that 3man cwkpq got nerfed (even though i dont do them myself) because its one of the few content hero/DK excels at. i wonder if maybe staff is discouraging 3man cwkpq or this was unintentional effect.
    I'd love to hear input from the guy that always says Hero is in a good spot and doesnt need a buff. I guess hero is quite good at NT, especially CB, one of the most profitable boss. *shrugs* but nonetheless a bit sad to see a indirect cleave nerf.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
  17. aiatsui
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    aiatsui Red Snail

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    Geez friend I'm sorry but I've never understood this mentality. This is a game, and part of it is getting to choose your own adventure, not simply follow a set of instructions so stringent that any slight deviation is punished and mocked. Why bother giving people choices at all if it's an illusion of freedom? I certainly put some points into CL at first to have fun zapping stuff because it was fun, and I don't think wanting to have fun is wrong. Let's stop fun-policing other players please. :(
     
    • Agree Agree x 13
  18. Vaessen
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    Vaessen Orange Mushroom

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    That sounds amazing. It will actually make mage gear useful. There is a ton of mage gear that are not being used.

    I thought Staves were 2-handed weapons..? If that is the case, would it be possible to remove the ability to equip a shield?
     
  19. Tommygunner
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    Tommygunner Mixed Golem

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    12:12 PM
    why would you ask this when luk builds and staffs are already inferior/harder to make viable? o.o
    or did you mean WAND's ability to equip shield??
     
  20. randomhs
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    randomhs Timer

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    12:12 PM
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    Oyasumi
    it's pretty funny and a bit ironic to have a bunch of awesome QoL improvements for PQs and then seeing this at the end
    like were people really crying about some classes being too mobile in bonus or what... because I really doubt anyone was complaining about it being too easy. it just feels like lazy way to "balance" mobility. instead of nerfing the QoL of all the classes (some more than others!), why not just improve the bonus stage for those who are struggling? here are some suggestions (mostly for cwkpq) that took less than a minute to come up with:
    • centralize spawn point
    • add teleporters
    • re-arrange chests and/or platforms
    • add ropes
    • increase time limit
    • give everyone flash jump
    it's so easy! unless the point of that change was to severely nerf 2/3 man runs then you can just ignore everything but consider adding that as an explanation in the 'balance changes explained' thread ;)

    ps. for anyone that complained about flash jump/teleport being op in bonus (i don't know if these ppl even exist), congratulations and have fun moving like a snail now!




    BUT TBH THAT'S ALL A DROP IN THE OCEAN COMPARED TO THE LONG AWAITED I/L BUFFS!! WOOHOO!!!!! SlimeLoveSlimeLove
    who cares about apq or cwkpq bonus amirite!!!!!
     
    • Agree Agree x 7
    • Friendly Friendly x 2
    • Like Like x 1
    • Great Work Great Work x 1

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