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Rumour on single target skill vs. AOE skill drop rate

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Sia YS, Oct 4, 2020.

  1. Sia YS
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    Sia YS Mano

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    5:31 PM
    I/L Wizard
    -
    As the subject, people are talking about single target skill actually make the drop rate better. Is that true?

    From my experience, my sister farmed full inventory of gachapon tickets(before it can stack) using 4 days(almost full day grinding) with lucky seven. While I use about 6 days to farm like 90+ gachapon with genesis.

    Both of us hunting at the map with great amount of mobs and good landscape.
     
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  2. Scylla
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    Scylla Orange Mushroom

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    Specifics about drop rates are not disclosed to the public, as far as I know. So I wouldn't expect an official statement regarding this.
     
  3. Vlad Panait
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    Vlad Panait Blue Snail

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    Hello,

    From what I have heard, the drop rate is nerfed for mages, especially when using ultimates. Card hunting with my f/p has been a pain because of this.
     
  4. gerg123
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    gerg123 Mano

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    I would like to know if it's only ultimates that nerf drops or also things like thunder bolt / ice strike etc
     
  5. Tate
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    Tate Capt. Latanica

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    trial and error seems to be the way to figure things out.
     
  6. Alyosha
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    Alyosha Skelegon Retired Staff

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    Drop rates aren't something that will be shared by staff.

    Nobody will stop you from trying to work them out in testing though, last year I had an idea for trying to figure it out, long before joining the staff. Let's say you kill 500 Goby houses(3,000 gobies) with X skill, and kill 500 more with Y skill. Gobies tend to be a lot easier to measure than other mobs, you know that 1 house is equal to 6 gobies so you only need to know how many houses you killed and the houses are in easy to see spots. With that data you ought to compare something that's uncommon as a drop, like say the bubbles or the Sunset Dew. Measuring equips leads to wild variation but less common drops are something that you can actually make a statistical inference from without going crazy with the sample size.
     
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  7. Eighty
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    Eighty Windraider

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    Evidence points to yes - drop rates are modified by the type of skills you use.

    Just from hours upon hours of playing, I know that dragon roar and dragon fury do in fact have lower drop rate than power strike.
     
  8. AioriaX
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    AioriaX Selkie Jr.

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    This rumour flourished during the times when Mannequins had auto-aggro.
    Many players farmed event ETCs (coins/fishing bait) there before they were nerfed and found that single target lower job skills had better ETC drop rates compared to those using multi-hit/cleave skills of higher job tiers.

    In my own experience, I had better yield from using double-stab compared to farming using avenger there, despite killing more mobs.
    The same yield was seen in many other players as well and soon after, everyone adapted using a single-target mob skills for better drop rate during event ETC farm.

    ie. Energy orb/magic claw mage farm versus using Paralyze
    ie. Lucky 7 versus avenger/triple throw
     
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  9. Huiae
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    Huiae Headless Horseman

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    F.....FPs......par is single target just same as orb/claw MapleF4

    TT is also not suit with .vs target of L7....MapleF6
     
  10. Quinale
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    Quinale King Slime

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    I know the staff want's to keep drop rate data away from the public, but I'm curious as to WHY they don't want to release the data when they want to be as transparent as possible on every other subject. I'm expecting something like "We don't want to release drop rates to the public because then the meta will change" and I guess I'm wondering why is that a bad thing? It will also give the ability to change the meta when changes to drop rates are made. Either way a meta will be formed and then changed when new information/data becomes available.
     
  11. Ferluci
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    Ferluci Zakum Retired Staff

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    Because people will make threads upon threads if an item is 1/100 droprate and they haven’t gotten it after 101 kills.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
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  12. Kimmy
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    Kimmy Administrator Staff Member Administrator Game Moderator

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    On top of that people will make maps meta based on numbers they see listed. There's much more behind it than just a %, which is why we also removed the 'drop rates' from the site and everything because drop rates make no sense when every server uses their own formula and drop chances.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  13. Asheesh
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    Asheesh Mano

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    I respect staff’s decision not to share drop rates but I feel like staff is missing the question, or maybe I am....

    There’s a lot of contemplation that single target has better rates then multi target and some say that it’s the same, I personally suffer with crippling ‘bad luck’ so I really just can’t tell wether assaulter (single target) or boom step (multi target) yields better results

    that said I don’t want to know if a particular scroll has a 1/100 drop chance or 1/50 drop chance etc. But rather wether single target skills in general have a higher drop chance or it’s just the same across the board.
    Knowing this would help me understand wether it’s simply down to bad luck or down to what skill I’m using when farming cards for example And allows me to make an informed decision on how I go about farming.

    A statement from staff just saying ‘single target ‘generally’ has better results.’ (Or whatever the case may actually be) would satisfy me and I assume others just fine.

    Just a personal note but knowing I get about 1 Gachapon per 1 - 2 hours whilst others average 5 makes me wonder what I’m doing wrong (I know bad luck isn’t a bug but it still hurts :( .)

    maybe it’s not actually as simple as I’m assuming it to be and staff can’t tell us without revealing other ‘drop rate secrets’ which is totally understandable
     
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  14. IHearColors
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    IHearColors Timer

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    From my experience, assaulter or any single-target skill works better than bstep (multi-target) when it comes to farming. Holding down assaulter in a flat map would yield me as much as 75 (averaged maybe 60) ice chests an hour during the event. Since all drops work on some statistical probability that none of us know the forumla for, getting consistent results to find specific drops isn't possible. The only way for you to figure out if single-target vs multi-target really makes a difference is for you to test it removing all other variables. Even under the same conditions (same map and able to 1-hit all mobs), you won't really know if there is a difference unless you farmed for hours using both methods. Clearly most people don't have time to do this, but its the most reliable means to figure out for yourself.

    Regardless of what skill you use, the chance of drops occurring is simply just that, by chance. You're not guaranteed a gachapon for every 10000 kills (random inaccurate number) if their drop rate is 0.01%. I'd say go with assaulter to farm because it has much better utility in more situations than bstep (even without the alleged better drop rates for single-target). It activates faster than bstep and is a great movement skill. Assuming you can 1-hit the mobs, you are likely to use assaulter twice by the time you use bstep once (basically 2 kills vs a max of 4 kills). What skills you use is just situational. Quick single kills with movement may be faster than 4 consecutive kills that put you out of reach to kill other mobs. Adding that on top of assuming single-target>multi-target in drop rates, then it would result in more drops.

    Again these are all from my personal experiences so take it with a grain of salt. Regardless of what method of farming you choose, the results are negligibly different unless you farm for hours and hours (more data=more accurate=more noticeable the different).
     
  15. HouseAuburn
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    HouseAuburn Capt. Latanica

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    Now here's my question: If the drop rate is affected by what skills you use, how exactly does it calculate what 'drop rate' to use? Is it the last skill used on that monster? What happens if you Thunder Bolt six mobs and then hit them all with Magic Claw afterwards? Would they all have Thunder Bolt drop rates or Magic Claw drop rates?

    If we are to assume the drop rate is different between skills, then the game must keep track of the skills used on a monster in some way.
     
  16. Arkadude
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    Arkadude Red Snail

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    to remove all other variables but attack type you would have to measure by amount of monsters killed, rather than by time.
    For example, take any of the Rememberer's "kill 999 monsters" quest and do it 2 times with exactly the same stats, but using different abilities. Remember to collect everything including etc' drops and compare the results later.

    If you feel like 999 is too small of a sample size try measuring how many you've killed by amount of exp gained. eg: set out to kill wraiths until you accumulate 250000 exp. Repeat twice.
     
  17. mukiday
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    mukiday Slime

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    Nice
    After seeing all those people win multiple raffles from the summer event cubes everyone's curious about the drop rates myself included
     
  18. Eighty
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    Eighty Windraider

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    My assumption is that they take into account the skill that does the finishing blow. Again, I have no proof.. just pure speculation from my personal experience.
     
  19. Diziple
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    Diziple Pac Pinky

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    Being unlucky is not a bug.

    I think it’s a known fact and we have gathered enough information from players that mage ultimates does lower the drop rates.

    For the remaining skills, I think you will have to play around and experiment with it, or check with players. Especially with RNG in play, you will definitely have to take a large sample size before you can determine the actual drop rates of a particular skill.

    Drop rates of NLs based on 2 year grinding experience : Avenger > TT.
    If you guys don’t believe me, try using Avenger to down HT on your last few hit (NL must white) and see fat splits rolling in. Okay I’m just kidding.
     
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  20. IHearColors
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    IHearColors Timer

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    This was in regards to more of which method is more efficient for farming rather than determining the better drop rates, but I guess those correlate with one another. Either way, yeah you're right.

    I think you would need a much larger sample size for some of the rarer drops such as gach as you're likely not to get one even after killing 1000 mobs.
     

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