Shads have mediocre damage and utility. We need more love.

Just make pickpocket great again, and I'm fine being able to farm well and boss sorta well

 

Ah it feels like I'm back in 2018 again, good times

 

geospiza your toxicfunny rankings has inspired people to farm them.

OT: shads who wash to 30k hp and have mesos guard have the most survivability in the game. Even way before that. You have the most avoid, most potential damage sponge. Smokescreen is a bit mediocre at 45 sec out of 300 sec. However, if it would be longer it'd be too OP, if the change is made as you suggest, it makes the skill straight up boring. It's easy to suggest a skill change, it's hard to suggest a good one and you've just proven a very shortsighted view on the class and its supportive ability.

Shads are all-rounders with insane grinding potential starting in 3rd job and even more so in 4th. Decent bossing damage but insane personal utility with the avoid and survivability.

 

Yo guys this ain’t league of legends with some kind of a fully staffed balance team. We playin a v.062 private server mushroom game with a balance team consisting of 1 volunteer. Expecting things like reworks and skill removals is an XD.

 

Weird way to spell PR team

 

Assassinate:
I do hate how the skill works and if it would be possible to change I would make it like post big bang: first press does the first hits press again do the last hit (not a rush), and the last hit does a lot of damage. I also dislike that you can't crit with this skill unless is the last hit
If you get the hang of it the damage is decent, it is true that when comes to single-target damage they are the weakest among the attackers (but don't get me wrong the damage still ok). The skill got buffed because before even an archmage could do more damage but well as I said now is ok. Also is pretty neat that you can charge up damage and release it when the boss cancels or reflects, and is not hard to do 4 hits of cap damage this way.
Seems the reason to hold back Shadower damage is that they are the most resilient job, especially if you wash since they have: 50% damage reduction even on 1/1, at high level you can easily avoid 80% of the incoming damage thanks to shifter and the big avoid stat. Eating sed will be your bread and butter in HT.
If you want to know an even slower attacker check out Buccaneer, a job that has the slowest attacks in the game but compensates with damage numbers, more bursty on damage rather than less and faster. As a Bucc main, I can say sometimes you use a skill and you see the hit coming cos the skill is so slow and if you got no charge you will fall down, or if you mess up the timing you get lasered by Vergamot.

Smoke Screen:
Perhaps it could take a funny buff like more damage when inside it hahah, but as it is is kinda ok, the cooldown and duration were reduced to have more uptime.
Not all the party skills have 100% uptime and are more used only on specific moments, like Time Leap, Resurrect, and Holy Shield. Skills designed to be saved and used only when necessary, Smoke Screen at times is like that, using the skill to ensure a resurrect and get a res when someone dies on a bad position (Like Zakum's Body), if anything it has a bit more utility since you can ensure your team does uninterrupted damage when a boss is on a magic cancel or in a vulnerable time.

Meso Guard:
Shad is super tanky thanks to the avoid they have and on top of it they have this skill that halves any incoming damage, this skill doubles the effective HP of the class as long as it's on. All jobs wash, no exception and is true some jobs do better than others with the washes, Shadower really benefits a lot from this, you may say you only gain 20hp per lv but thanks to guard its like 40 and with HB this becomes even better.
Just for fun lets see the other melee jobs:
DK- You MUST wash a DK to get cap hp and even then your HP caps at 16.5k if you want to do damage, a fuck up and you are dead that's the life of a DK. Is a warrior so even with the beholder buff you will not avoid anything unless you are extremely lucky.
Hero/Paladin- Pretty tanky thanks to Achilles and Power Guard, when comes to physical attacks they do pretty well but they got only one weakness: like any other warrior you got no avoid if you are seduced and you get 1/1 it's over. Also, avoid gives a huge edge on a boss like Pink Bean that loves to spam stuns that's why thieves are pretty good there.
Buccaneer- This job outside I.Frames (that you don't always spam or have available, so you are still vulnerable at times) you have no defensive skills. KurayamiLove has at lv200 14.5k HP and I did just a bit of washing, she can't PB and needs HB or certain parts of HT can 1 shot me, even with my new Bucc having cap HP (Which is very annoying to achieve and needed a lot of MP washing) and even with that I will never be able to tank HT's Tail, as shad you need 16k hp and is not that hard to get with HB and you can tank the tail if you even get hit. PB touch damage is a bit annoying to take as Bucc, a reverse, and zombify and you can easily screw up and die. I won't say all is bad, the I.Frames makes Bucc decent DPM on PB and some chaotic bosses, but well shadower's avoid is still better in this situation.

Sorry for the long reply, see ya!!

 

Shad isn't supposed to be a main attacking class. Its a jack of all trades. Smokescreen is a huge utility skill: used for ressing safely, used for allowing low hp users to walk through boss to get MoN, lets the entire party attack with no knockback. They also trade off damage for huge survivability.

 

Shadower is what Paladin should have: a tank.

 

Incoming shad nerfs.

 

I think there is some merit here although a bit blown out of proportion. I don't have a shad tho so feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

1. For a support class I agree smoke has terrible uptime and benefits mostly those with low avoid/prone to knock back (I guess archers and sairs). If you could somehow code smoke to give a pt buff while on CD, idk maybe like +30-40 avoid, it might have better utility.
2. Nate DMG is pretty bad for single DPS I agree. It's only really good in niche situations like scar/targ where wc makes charging in ds actually relevant.
3. Bstep does less cleave DMG than warrior cleaves but doesn't bstep hit 4? I think if you summed the DMG across 4 mobs it might put you slightly under warrior 3-cleaves. I think justified if shads are purported as supports. Just need to change meta to make 4-cleave a thing outside of grinding (and I think it is at HT).

For a support class, Shads don't provide a lot of support. The lower DMG seems to be in lieu of their really good survivability. If they were to be changed I would nerf their avoid and change smoke to have better uptime.

 

Assassinate
Not the best, not the worst. Kinda mediocre I agree but seems to be in an OK place.
It actually lets us close the gap pretty nicely in terms of damage in bosses with WCancel / Damage reflect since it gives us a chance to charge up.

Smokescreen

If you've been in boss runs before you will know how greatly appreciated it is. Yes, it's a luxury skill, but what's wrong with a bit of luxury?
45 seconds of party invincibility every 5 minutes might sound bad, but boss runs don't last 5 minutes.
If you think about it from a greater perspective.. Say your HT run lasts 1 hour.. that's 9 minutes of invulnerability.
Technically it gives effective damage and a defensive stat which makes your party invulnerable allowing your party to do it's maximum potential damage. Knockbacks and repositioning affect your damage quite abit.
Assuming we use your 15 pots per smoke quote, and we use 12 smokes in the aforementioned 1 hour HT run, that's 180 pots saved. Run a second time, 360 pots saved.
It all adds up in the long run.

Meso Guard

As someone who minimally washed and reached level 200 with ~7.4k hp with pet hp equips, I am very grateful for this skill as it allowed me to do the 'final' boss, PB.
It helps us save even more $$ than we already do on pots.

Shads are a cheapo jack of all trades class. We literally use <200 pots and around ~1m in MG costs in PB whilst most others might use 5m+, what more can you ask for.

But yes, if you're looking for a class purely for damage.. gubi.

 

Wait until the shad mule revolution and you will see that shadowers are truly the class with the most utility.

 

Then watch them get nerfed due to muling.

 

Shadowers suck because we don't have Shadow Partner despite our name

 

how many shads would be needed to spam smoke nonstop 1 after the other and disregard any need for hp or tankiness then ? xP

 

Are people really making Shadowers expecting top-tier single target damage?

Also, Smoke is bad utility? Imagine if self-smoke was buyable in stores & no one picked Shads for smoke, ever.

How do you complain about meso guard? I'm shocked.

 

My pov is that not every class needs to be super shredded or do top dpm. I am kinda sad that my damage isn't that top tier, but I do really like my high avoid and meso guard a lot and I think if shads really were as awful as you say then no one would play it (I still see lots of ppl playing it tho).

All my party members do seen to enjoy smoke when I do it too ^^ And it's been very useful when ressing people as well

I do think that assassinate is jank af tho, I've dashed into Zak body sometimes and taken some hits. I'm also kinda bummed SE and SI doesn't work on Shads but you can't have everything I guess. I think they're in an alright spot RN.

Note: speaking as a casual 16X shad, and not as a member of staff.

 

Idk why people consider not needing SI or SE for max damage a downside. Playing on a DK it’s incredibly noticeable when I don’t have both buffs and it’s not that enjoyable lugging around mules all the time. Personally I’d love to not need SI and SE and still do max damage.

 

i feel like i made this post in the past during the dark days of shadower