Skills Balance: Increase Shadow Stars time

sure i'll make the trade (^: SE please btw

 

A needy NL complains about Shadow Star, imagine my shock

 

Mr. GM sir, for the sake of fairness, can you give NLs stance+hb too?

 

Time to derail this thread, since nobody ever seems to want to talk about cost of operation of different classes. For bossing (ht specific since that's what was brought up), there is definitely an argument for looking at how much a given character spends to achieve its damage. With shadow star the way it is, they can get by spending literal peanuts on stars, and similar for potions. An archer has to spend way more in terms of cost from lower avoid and lack of shifter. They spend even more now if they want to make use of the extra attack boost. I can see an argument for the benefit not being "enough" to warrant its cost and just use soul arrow throughout. I'm not sure on the comparison for sair (avoid stacked versions) vs archers, as recharge costs could sway it either way.

I'm honestly surprised there's been so much emphasis on just the DPM45, with no consideration on how much gets spent. Over the course of an HT career, those differences really do add up. With many classes now operating on a relatively "balanced" playing ground damage-wise, its the cheaper classes that stand to gain the most.

 

Dpm45 is a trap. Bcz potential dpm45 #1 class is FP.
Now time to say FP needs nerf. Ahaha......

Yes, only figuring dpm45 isnt good way to debate balance. You got a point.

Believe or not, I made lv.199 NL in this server long ago......Mate, I think it is enough to say my opinion about that class D:...

Just go rcg T.T

 

Not too sure what the pot cost are now (for corsair), but back when HT was spamming mana burn like crazy my corsair was burning roughly 2m in NLC potions per HT run (avoid stacked btw).

I had ~13.5k hp and 4k mp.

One of the reasons I think that it isn't discussed is that you can't even really compare the cost to boss among classes alone - because it varies immensely depending on how much someone has HP or MP washed.

You have to compare it among classes that are washed to the same degree - which is something thats hard to quantify when everyone hp washes different amounts.

For example my paladin (30k hp, lowish mp) burns ~1.75m in ginseng root per HT. If I had mp washed my paladin so that mana drains don't instantly burn all my mp and trigger a pot, my cost would be ALOT lower.

At the same time, a paladin who didn't hp wash to 30k (maybe they only washed to 20k) would spend much more than me.

I would speculate than an insanely washed bowmaster would spend less meso on potions than a lightly washed nightlord.

 

Washing definitely has an impact on an individual character's cost of living. One of the reasons why I say to wash higher even if you meet minimum thresholds for hp/mp. That said, the comparison between thieves and archers is fairly straightforward, since they have the same washing nx to hp ratio and base hps. Even shad can be accounted for as meso guard uses a flat meso:hp for the damage "blocked" with meso guard (but still a cost to account for). Things get a bit messier though with warriors, mages, and pirates without an agreed upon washing standard, but can still be compared on an intra-class basis (like dk vs hero costs).

I dont know real numbers, but among the ranged classes NL very likely has an insanely cheaper cost per run assuming equal washing.

 

Everybody has already spoke in depth, so I'll just leave something I always preach:

Comparing "similar" skills between classes are never a good reason to propose a balance change. Classes are meant to be different, and while some skills may overlap, they should remain being different.

If you want shadow star to be buffed, please bring the numbers and facts and show us why it needs a change (no, your bowman knowledge, or lack thereof, does not count). From what I can tell from other people's posts, NLs are already competitive and shadow star doesn't need a change at the moment.

Sure it's a good skill, but it doesn't stack with other atk buffs/pots and it has a cooldown. It's not the most favored buff skill on ML.

 

Dear thread starter, as a fellow Nightlord I completely understand your suggestion, and do agree that a buff to the duration of Shadow Star would definitely be most helpful, especially in times where we forget to rebuff or want to optimise more USE space for other potions and carry less stars.

However I also feel like at the current state in ML, NLs are in a healthy position (although the sad fact of Alchemist nerf ) in terms of balance. Having the Shadow Star bug lasting throughout my whole ML career really helped me save a lot of money in terms of filling up my 20 slots with MTK / recharge price per MTK x amount of bossing runs I've been, but I think in terms of overall quality of life, a 2-minute duration is still a comfortable balance that a buff seems quite unnecessary at this stage.

It is true that in the future this bug may be fixed once the source has been identified, and maybe this suggestion would prove a different story then, but I myself carry 24-stars and they were pretty sufficient to last me even two Horntail runs of 2-hours each. During regular grinding, my stars do not drain down to zero that quickly either.

For everyone else who disputed this suggestion just because of the comparison between NLs to other class in terms of balance, I think its pretty unfair to just diminish this suggestion if you're not looking from an NL standpoint, but I do understand where you're all coming from. And I agree that in terms of balance and comparison to other classes, NLs are still in a pretty healthy position.

As a server that is striving for that nostalgic experience, I don't think we want to make our lives TOO EASY in MapleLegends. Otherwise we could argue to just buff every skill duration to 10 minutes for all classes I guess?

At the end of the day, if you disagree with this statement and ask for an extra minute to the buff, it all comes down to being alert and taking a split second to look at the top right of your screen to notice the ending of your Shadow Star buff, and not about the duration. Because if we could forget to rebuff in 2 minutes, whats there to say about 3 minutes? Probably won't make a difference.

 

As a fellow NL, I think the shadow star bug should be fixed asap

 

I think NightLords are fine just fix Shadow Stars I'm also a NightLord(soon) main, they're fine just the way they are with or without Shadow Star bug.

 

Are you using 16sets of mtk?