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The reason why our ToS needs to change

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by fael, Jul 6, 2023.

  1. Pelinsu
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    Pelinsu Timer

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    If I have an issue with the ToS -which I stated above that I'm verry happy with it- I can still come here on this thread where we discussed the whole thing and state whatever opinion I have. This is why the forum exists.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  2. Vowels
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    Vowels Mr. Anchor

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    cause some people just see this as an 'us vs them' thing. Self-righteous players on this side, toxic players on the other side, they battle in the middle, very epic.
    if you have disagreements with ToS it's because you are a toxic idiot and not because there's legitimate concerns regarding autonomy, privacy, context, etc
     
    • Agree Agree x 5
  3. beegoratto
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    beegoratto Zakum

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    Yeah honestly it felt so unproductive. Instead of making arguments of why the ToS was good/bad or why the proposed changes were good/bad, just strawman arguments of "if you dont like the tos you probably just want to be toxic". The main reason this thread went so long imo is there's too many people making personal attacks and trying to judge others rather than trying to be constructive.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
  4. -ovv
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    -ovv Horntail

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    The problem is the entirety of section 3. Abuse within the Community should be treated as civil cases as they always involve two parties. However, the punishments for these match that of criminal cases.

    I find it ridiculous that someone can get booted off this server for saying something unintentionally stupid in a public discord meant for shooting the shit, let alone making a joke in a private discord amongst friends -- and this could have happened years ago with strikes still counting toward your last. All it takes is for someone to be offended enough to report it - and the extent to which one is offended cannot ever be properly challenged or disputed by Staff. I can easily scrounge through the official MapleLegends discord and isolate exchanges between active players in order to submit a report based on the pretense that I am offended, even if not directly involved. The current version of ToS still allows for that, and Staff are held under the gun to follow through and are powerless to object to my offendedness.

    IMO, this is more destructive to the community than it is protective.
     
    Last edited: Jul 21, 2023
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  5. OP
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    fael
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    fael Nightshadow

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    These last 3 posts pretty much sum up everything I had to say, specially the first. Thanks <3
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 2
  6. TORONTOTOKYO
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    TORONTOTOKYO Windraider

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    i have a better suggestion. REMOVE PB. contentious boss that leads to drama and bans.
     
    • Creative Creative x 6
  7. LiquidOoze
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    LiquidOoze Mixed Golem

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    Post like these make me miss how many funny reacts you would earn.
     
    • Agree Agree x 5
  8. TORONTOTOKYO
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    TORONTOTOKYO Windraider

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    i mean. its true right. since when do u see drama and bans becos of other bosses, e.g. zak?
     
  9. Edann
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    Edann Slimy Retired Staff

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    It's all about creative react now
     
    • Creative Creative x 9
  10. Palladino
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    Palladino Master Chronos

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    I love the maplelegends forums.

     
    • Great Work Great Work x 16
  11. OP
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    fael
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    fael Nightshadow

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  12. Huiae
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    Huiae Headless Horseman

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    As one who is considered as one of end-game players (even though I'm quite doubtful for that), with my all heart, I truly wish to say, not every end game players accept toxicity and agree on It's bad necessary. or at least, I do think so. Toxicity can be excluded, and It should be. Recent ToS change is one of great attempts for that, and I do believe this would be nice step to going forward. I don't think this is perfect and 100% right, but this has potential for better future. I believe so.

    I'm curioused why this 'cursed thread' (I love this mention MirrorsMirrors LOOOOL) still luring ppls.
     
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2023
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  13. fartsy
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    fartsy Zakum

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    conflict is inherent in human nature and exists in both war and peace. if there are forceful changes (see funny emote) it just changes to some different form (creative). let's not pretend it doesn't exist. i'm sure even at some more "inclusive" circles, it's taxing to keep up some illusion of a clean, perfect self.
     
    • Creative Creative x 4
  14. Nise
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    Nise Supervisor Staff Member Supervisor Game Moderator

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    Imagine how taxing it is for staff xD
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
  15. -ovv
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    -ovv Horntail

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    Now imagine if the Staff position was treated less like a strict, professional obligation and more as a volunteer moderator of a small community? I feel like that'd be a lot less stressful.

    It's a given that Staff aren't perfect, and there should be no expectations for Staff to be perfect.
     
  16. fartsy
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    fartsy Zakum

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    I think there shouldn't be much of a problem if rules are direct without space for interpretation - as long as it's enforced evenly. It'd be hard to accuse staff of bias if a reason for enforcement is literally there, and will cap any discontent. It's not rare for players to view Staff as a club; percieved abuses of power just make players vote with their feet.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  17. -ovv
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    -ovv Horntail

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    I think this is wishful thinking in terms of policymaking.
     
  18. fartsy
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    fartsy Zakum

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    totally is, but we strive toward an ideal
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  19. TORONTOTOKYO
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    TORONTOTOKYO Windraider

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    could be a utopia tho.
     
  20. Nise
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    Nise Supervisor Staff Member Supervisor Game Moderator

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    Think the problem is there is also a sizeable percent of the community that want the reverse. Actions/behaviors/lack of action are held against us. The smallest things we do are nitpicked and scrutinized. Reported for staff abuse, or rumors spread that x staff member is partaking in staff abuse. Etc.

    Then it no longer becomes a volunteer position of a small community, and more of a professional obligation.

    Often times, Staff is a product of the community, their actions, and their demands.
     
    • Agree Agree x 8
    • Like Like x 1

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