Feedback The State of Dark Knights and Moving Forward

The DK spot in meta is exactly the discussion. We got the HP Challenge because the world where everyone is washed don’t exist, and it takes 5-7 years of voting to wash a fully HB independent ranged attacker.
So the whole server benefits from DKs being available and strong on PB+auf (the main bosses where HB is really needed).
They having self-SI opens an important slot on the PT they are placed.

Looking at PB, if a bucc needs HB he is in a tight spot. Usually DKs are muled and in a ranged PT. The Bucc is placed on pally/hero pt as they benefit from SI. Putting a bucc on the ranged pt removes all benefits from SI.

BUT, if DKs are meta, we can simply find 2 (or more) active players to fill the PTs AND deal damage.

Now, the discussion turns to hp challenge buccs, and I really think the Hp they get is too low for a meele attacker. Warriors get their 30k with challenge+equips, I think buccs should get ~24k Hp around 200.

 

5-7 years of voting lol

 

I don't know where you get 5-7 years of voting from, but there are literally posts where people achieved 30k hp on ranged chars in less than 3 years. From Krythan's post, it took him 2 years, 7 months and 5 days to achieve 30k hp and 8.5k mp. To get a ranged attacker washed enough (~19k hp), it can take less than 2 years. People who aimed for PB right at the start of their journey usually went for washing, and people who just played for fun without any goals, or people who absolutely detest washing will go for hp challenge. The world where everyone is washed don't exist? I am absolutely certain that there are runs where everyone is washed. And I believe a world where most attackers are washed and only a certain few are hp challenged is more likely to happen than a world where all attackers are hp challenged.

And the whole server benefits from NL being stronger, and yet so many people wants to bring them down. Also, auf is currently dominated by melee classes, and bucc is in the party. With the new changes, DKs place in meta might be more in auf rather than PB. So, is SI independence justified in auf?

So sairs and mm are not considered ranged classes anymore? They might need both HB and SI. Should we give SI to sairs and mm so that they can be fitted into a ranged party not requiring SI? It can free up important slots on the PT they are placed.

Indeed, hp challenged bucc should get more hp.

 

Speaking of "years" timeframe in current day and age is crazy talk when it comes to videogames and being able to participate in content.
Not saying you are wrong, its just clear it will drive away most players after they hit level 130 or whatever

 

Because they’re using hyperbole.

My primary attacker was made 1 month after I started playing and fully washed out within 6 months. It’s still my most used character today, almost 4 years later, and can participate in every single fight in the game without HB. There’s even more options for washing today than there were then.

 

Will we be able to make use of the 110% passive zerk bonus during part one of the active zerk, or will the active always take priority and overwrite the passive bonus?

On another note, if DK can get all these custom animation changes, shirley MM can get a snipe animation buff as a little treat.

 

So to sum it up, the Berserk is
1) passively you get a damage increase that scales with how much life total you are missing
2) you also gain access to active part of ability, that grants you some crowd control reduction and reliably 100% damage increase, no matter what your current hp is
3) the active part of ability has to be charged by hitting enemy some times, similar to bucc/marauder energy charge

Is that right?

edit:
I just noticed the hit count on the buff icons, what happens if you dont get to 18 attacks count and the buff duration fades? i assume you lose it and have to build from begining again

 

It still feels a *little* odd to get a bigger damage bonus than vanilla as it means players will feel like they should use the new feature either on cooldown or lined up with the "dpm time" between cancels/drs, even in situations when they dont need the defensive benefits of full hp zerk, dr immunity and mini shield. Though its not a massive difference if charging isnt as strong as 55% zerk, I suppose. But even looking at it on the defensive side, having to use it 20 seconds before you want the shield benefit is certainly going to be awkward, and was likely crafted specifically in response to the skill cooldowns of current high end fights. Fits in snugly for auf and pb dr rotations, but then the goal becomes to always use the charging portion when things use cancels/drs. Maybe you try to coordinate with bishop and stagger it with a shield to maximize protection coverage, but then youre breaking cycle and losing damage by holding the cast, or overlapping coverage as the rest of the party needs shielding too (and shields come in response to triggers, not immediately on cooldown). Ill have to wait to get my hands on it to truly know my opinions, but the mini shield is arguably the most enticing bit of this iteration of active and yet on paper seems like you'll have to sacrifice damage as well as see into the future if you want to line it up with anything meaningful. Or just mindlessly pop it off cooldown or into cancels/drs when there's minimal chance of failing the quick time event and hope it blocks something.

I predict the eventual thread when somebody starts charging, gets dped, stunned or knocked off ht platform, and is forced to passive zerk with less damage for 40 seconds

heal/blood zerk cap waiting room

 

But everything else (stance, booster, hb etc) is. The cast time is recoverable with faster attacks like fury/sacrifice, but somebody's gonna complain during crunch time.

 

Since we're hanging on the point of dispel, let me make sure the point is clear: I dont mean dispel drops active zerk, but rather you'll find yourself stanceless, boosterless and your party will not have hb (and possibly mw if youre the source). I went ahead and did some napkin 18 crusher time trials on dummy with a rebuff pit stop (I believe 18th only needs to start to register in time). My best time looked like ~18 seconds including a recast of stance, booster, hb and mw with a speed 6 spear and basically 19 seconds with a slow spear. Though thats with no stance fails and being ready to rebuff asap with macro'd buffs/attacks. I dont think it's worth throwing everything out over, but some poor parties are gonna have to wait for the dk to finish for HB

More importantly, Dragon's Blood has a cooldown and is dispellable. Undispellable as a treat?

 

Looking at these numbers, it does look very promising and am very excited to see how this plays out in end game content.

The only question I have is about the cast time of active zerk. From the teaser, it *looks* like the cast time has been changed as there is no 'cast animation'. Has the cast time been changed similar to that of Active Shifter?

 

Final attack stonks?!

 

Even if you finish charging early it looks like you have to let the buff fully expire (right click shenanigans mayhaps?). Assuming you complete the quick time event, it goes:

Active: 100% (20 sec) -> Special+Shield 120% (20 sec) -> Special 120% (20 sec)

Compared to passive zerk:
110% cap throughout, with minor losses above 55%.

It will still be more damage to always use it in neutral situations over passive zerk, doubly so if there are safe downtimes or the back half of a shield to burn the weaker 100% wind up on. Just dont be a fool and activate it when you know there's an unprotected sed coming and it shouldn't be an issue

 

Big time lurker here...

Firstly, I would thank staff and BT for their good work. As a DK player myself, I'm very excited to try out the new DK playstyle...
From my perspective, it is (almost) a no brainer to always use active zerk whenever available for later contents when you cannot maintain 100% passive zerk uptime at 55% hp. (maybe hold and wait a bit if you know there is an incoming Sed/Stun or timing active to charge on PB DR cancel for eg), the max at 55% hp threshold is nice and I can finally stop giving my bishop friends anxiety when they are looking at the party HP bar. it also allows a more dynamic playstyle when you have to mix in furies during the charging phase when things go wrong and you have to clock these 18 attacks in order to hit that sweet bonus

However, not sure this was intended but in certain contents, CWK in particular, where you can easily maintain 100% uptime on passive zerk, it is debatable whether you should be using active zerk at all since you suffer a penalty during the charging phase and was not sufficiently rewarded for completing the charge. you most likely going to miss the special bonus if you get stunned during the charge and it very much comes down to RNG. 3% DPS increase for completing the charge vs -3% DPS loss for missing the charge.

Since my understanding of the BT philosophy is to promote active gameplay, I would assume that popping active will always have a slight edge against a pure passive zerker, that does not seem to be the case for contents when you can confidently maintain 100% passive zerk up time but not 100% special phase activation here

Also just to throw in another point on slow spears, the more prevalent active zerk play is going to be (which is probably every single end game content), the more disadvantaged slow spears are. Making Skis and Alchupiz the only real meta pick moving forward...