Feedback Upcoming Marksman updates and plans

- Stance during PA charge: +1
Necessary if we want MMs to start tanking zak arms to hit 4 or 6 arms at a time with PA. Same idea with HT parts. Doing so would indeed lead to higher total dps than Strafe+Snipe-ing a single arm, so is rewarding, though does not feel very archer-like.

- PA doesn't get converted to bow-wack: +3
Also necessary for the scenario above. Also just annoying when a mob spawns in front of me when I'm about to release the key.
Decreases the importance of positioning and aggro control in solo play, but probably minimal.

- PA can start being charged in the air: +1
It's QoL, so definitely not against it, but I'm not sure when I would notice.

- Fully charged PA hitting 4 mobs changes damage cap: -2
I just don't think it makes sense. It's a buff purely for Snipe, which could be done in other ways.

- Snipe visual effect update: +1
I actually like the current Snipe effect. I think the arrow spinning while travelling is all it needs. The auditory queue when shooting could change though. I find that I don't hear it over all the strafing right now. (I imagine this is more work, though)
Just please not the second effect update.

If we want to make Snipe stronger:
Add a (reasonably small) 5s buff to reward using on cooldown. (5% crit, 3 att)
Or if we want to turn MM into the stance "ranged" attacker, 5s stance. (Probably bad idea)

 

Random shower thought but it just occurred to me that pierce being usable up close could translate to MMs larping as shads at zak arms, i.e. jump piercing to hit bottom four arms, assuming top right arm is already covered (or similarly at HT legs/tail phase). Tragically, as with many of the other eligible scenarios, the bonus effect on snipe would just go wasted as you would be better off continuing to cleave.

It seems to me that this snipe bonus is largely relevant at early/low-tier content (e.g. rav/eph/zak body), but this goes counter to the given mission statement of wanting to provide better scaling to the class, which is only an issue at the high end of things where one likely wouldn't be participating in such content to begin with. I suppose jury's arguably still out on how good it'll be with mini beans at PB body (would need more concrete numbers). Berga is another later boss where this effect could be relevant but the fact that you have to jump like three times to get to the height of the mob spawn point and then have to jump back down off the boat seems like it would kill any gains. It would be situationally useful in core if you're running with a weak cleaver. 2nd body toad is I think the last one where it might be any good but do I have to comment on the state of toad?

Anyways, just a bit of unorganized stream of thought. All in all, I'd have to agree with others in that the implementation of the damage cap effect feels rather jarring.

 

i'd be happy with jump casting and a little more avoid

 

Am I the only one who finds it strange that the damage cap is lifted for only snipe in particular? MM is not the only class that's "gimped" by artificial caps. See: tma cap, blast, panic, etc.

Not a fan of the strange preferential treatment here.

 

Yes, the BMs must also get their damage cap removed for equality.

 

oh god, i can just imagine the outbursts that will happen if BT buffed pallies by removing their dmg cap. Tho I guess i do agree with you to a certain degree.

In terms of "preferential treatment," couldn't you also say that's kinda part of having different classes? Their "power budget" is spent in different ways.

 

MM Changes has finally come~ as a 173 LVL Challenged MM, i'd say it's....nice and interesting, although i got some question and feedback
1. PIERCING ARROW (PA)
While the general changes like Stance, Fired at close range and even allow charging in the air is a positive and good change.

However, this last line got me interested where it could enable cleaving and possibly solve some issues, however the few things/scenario i thought is:

• At first the boss body parts/ boss number could be numerous, but as the battle goes on the number of mobs could reduce which could render this mechanic a bit redundant due to not able to hit the 4 mobs count mechanic which makes marksman switch to Strafe Snipe Combo which could not benefit this buff at all.
• Some Cleave cases you could be close to the mob to tank while cleave (not sure it's entirely possible), it also makes snipe buff redundant as well due to the fact Snipe still get the 1 knockback so how's that gonna help in cleave damage or DPS in general?
• While my combo for DPS/Cleave is mainly either 6/7 Strafes > Snipe or 3 Piercing Arrow > Snipe, while the current suggestion can buff the cleave potentials, it leaves the DPS compartment untouched

So overall while Piercing Arrow Change is good, the last line concerns me, if i were to provide feedback how to improve this case, i suggest move that buff to snipe instead and make it 6-7 seconds buff, so it awards players to continuously sniping while performing EITHER strafe or PA while accomplishing what the current suggested PA changes is doing also, if you missed the timing well, you get the usual lower damage snipe. But in fear of balance, if Snipe Fixed Damage is reduced, i don't mind it get reduced just to ensure it won't be too overpowered with the new calculation when doing both Strafe Combo/Piercing Arrow Combo
Also i do like the Snipe Effect 1 more than 2 since the hit effect looks sick.

PS. speed infusion in Snipe when?

 

Now that you mention it, what is the state of toad? I haven't been there in years

 

I'm a Hero main who wants Panic to be better, but I think it makes sense thematically that Snipe is the one, personally. Snipe consistently caps damage and is supposed to be a single yet very powerful shot with huge damage and it even has a cooldown to showcase how taxing the shot is. If any skill is to unlock the cap, I think it's fair that it'd be Snipe.

Granted, would be nice if Snipe AND Panic had the caps lifted lmao

 

You are already required to press snipe every 5 seconds, so now we throwing a constant PA charge into the mix?
Am I playing a bucc with a constant combo attack? Am I playing a shad with a constant 4 cleave in order to get my "dmg buff"?
I'm a 13k hp MM why do I want to be close to touching any boss ever. I want to sit back and pew pew.

These are the times I use PA: JC for about 2 minutes, start of CWK run, time it with zak mob spawn becuase I think its fun, and rarely at core, dragons breath is usually used first.
Never done Auf and maybe there are some situations I'm not thinking of.
So these are the only times I will get a damage increase for a few seconds?

A geared up MM should maybe have their damage formulas adjusted to match other classes when attack gear is similar. Not sure on the numbers or why the scaling is so bad.
Overall I like other suggestions on just buffing strafe damage or adding an additional line, buffing avoid, keeping it simple. Maybe do some tweaks to blind instead?
Glad to see some updates and plans in motion, take your time with it no need to rush. We been hot garbage for awhile now.
Thank you for the snipe visual update.

 

lv 167 Xbow.

Firstly, I’m a huge fan of removing the PA minimum-distance requirement for casting the skill. I think if Dragon Breath’s minimum-distance requirement could also be removed, it would make for a nice QOL improvement.

Similar to what others have already mentioned, I like the new effect on Piercing Arrow that increases the max damage cap. However, the 4-mob requirement feels a bit awkward. For CWK (cleave), we’d be relying on the boss to summon mobs just to meet this requirement. On top of that, when cleaving as MM at CWK, I’m not fully convinced PA would even be useful for clearing the summons. The time it takes to charge and cast the skill often means mobs may already have moved out of range, requiring extra adjustments to reposition them. In this situation, we’re forced to depend on the warrior boss’s summons to benefit from PA’s effect—but if we use PA during the summon, we risk having mobs scatter before the PA arrow fires. Personally, if I were cleaving CWK as MM, I’d probably use Arrow Eruption instead to clear the mobs. With that in mind, and could PA’s secondary effect be triggered when hitting 3 mobs instead of 4?

Additionally, I was thinking about ways to synergize Blind with other MM skills. For example, in additional to the current effect, attacking a monster/boss with Blind status using Snipe or Strafe could trigger a secondary effect (e.g., IED, guaranteed crit, +1 strife line, or an increased crossbow mastery effect from e.g. 90% → 110%). If the secondary effect mentioned above is too OP, an additional idea could be to rework Blind from a self-buff into an AoE debuff: once cast, it applies Blind to all nearby mobs for ~30 seconds, with a 60-second cooldown so this way the secondary effect wouldn't have 100% uptime. AoE debuff effect also means when boss have multiple parts, MM won't have to attack each sections to inflict the blind status effect.

For the visual effects of Snipe, I prefer the first one more.

 

Is marksman truly marksman if they're known for precision but their core identity skill is unable to specify targets?

 

I think I'm in agreement with most people here. Piercing Arrow changes seem good, although I'm not sure how practical it'd be to achieve and sustain the damage cap boost. I would prefer a different condition to trigger the damage cap boost. Maybe landing 5 Strafes?

I also prefer the first option for Snipe updated visuals.

As others have also suggested, I feel like if Piercing Arrow can be fired at close range, then Dragon Breath should be able to as well (cute little buff for Bowmasters as well).

No strong opinions on changing other aspects of Marksman's kit. In fact, I would rather see how these changes play out before doing anything more.

 

Allow MM's blizzard to crit.

I really don't see why it is not allowed as freezing is not strong enough of an effect to justify the massive damage loss from criticals.

Other classes with freezing skills when given SE are allowed to crit as well, so I don't see why not.

 

MM 166 now and started putting points in PA. Even on low level i have to say that i love the skill and try to use it in a lot of different bossing situations.
This are the things that i have seen and think are the minor annoyances the skill have;
1: can not cast the skill while a mob start hugging you.
2: getting ping ponged over the map since i need to land a jumping PA.
3: to short of a range resulting in me going to closer ranges in order to hit all targets and potentially putting me in danger since im a low hp range class. Often bosses spawn mobs in the center of them. Or body parts are spread out across the map. I when i charge the piercing arrow i feel like this should reach a bigger distance then normal strave.

Another suggestion for PA what if it marks the mob and when a mark procs it deals bonus crit dmg over SE and always crits. All party members can proc the marks.

Also I think Blizzard could also use an update Maybe make it so that it can also crit and or deal magic damage.

A buff on blind to make it more noticeable. Dont have to be a big up scale just enough to appreciate it more.

Frostpray maybe deals magic damage instead of weapon damage.

Dragons Breath also have to issue that when mobs start hugging you, it can not be cast.

I want to add that for this class i dont mind trading damage for utility and comfort for the party. Thats what i like the most of this class. Having a special skill for every situation.

Now for visual
I like option one the default. But i think a main issue with the skills visibility is the colour. yellow and white. it makes it difficult to see when you are in a fight. I suggest changing the colour to a green or blue or red. to make it stand out more.
(the second i really dont like looks overdone and not clean)

Also the strave arrows for me get a bit boring after a while. Could MM get NX cash arrows that change strave arrow animation? just like NL with their stars. Some people might not like it since its often seen as to much which hinders visibility. But i think that is not always the case it all comes down to which NX item you use. They are not all bad.(few idea's would be; default in different colours, flaming arrows red and blue, snakes, penciles, fireworks, paintbals, toilet paper, water beams "from water gun", xmas candy cains. some can also be used as stars and some stars as arrows)

Lastly i want to say. I love MM the way it is now. it is very fun to play. And i dont feel like i do very low damage. However i do noticed that gearing up a MM is barely noticeable. I like it the way it is underrate but very good and cheap. The main focus of the post is PA. But i just wanted to share my thoughts for the entire class. Hope u dont mind

 

exp is fine but a pot burner, low mesos/ coin and the fact that it’s basically just a thicccer krexel makes it quite unattractive to fight. If its coins gets buffed or drop table changes then it would be decent. It has no end game appeal imho.

 

Toad used to be pretty free exp, but for some reason staff decided to massively increase the defense & it's been dead content ever since

If you run as bucc with other buccs it's kinda ok

 

I thought MM scaling was bad because they use strafe as their main attack skill and don’t have something like berserk to make their 3rd job skill stronger, and snipe hits damage cap at a fairly low level. Do xbows have a lower scaling than other weapons?

 

buffing the strongest early game range that make pure dmg w/o gear, buffing his cleave too alltho his cleave is the best from the range classes if im right ,adding on top of that 100% stance by a simple click .
I realy concern at the path the server going so far