Why HP washing sucks & suggestions

Yes exactly, but that does mean that challenge rewards are too low for said classes. Because "even a very minor and easy wash is more beneficial than doing challenges".

 

So I agree, but these classes already have an easier wash, so there's no reason why makes it easier

 

It's not about providing something easier, it's about providing an alternative.
Isn't that why the HPC came to life? To be an alternative method to gain more stats?
Even so, mages, Warriors (and Pirates to some degree) don't actually need any washing to begin with. Even shads could be argued (because of meso guard). Yet people still do it (I mean, it's free, compared to OG). That's no reason to lock out everybody who doesn't wash out of some extra hp/mp (challenge locks you out of washing so....)

 

No. HPC came about so that people would not get locked out of content for not having enough hp. Not a way to gain hp indefinitely to a sweaty tryhard build.

 

This is a new phenomenon. Almost all of the posters in this thread had their first characters grow up in eras without challenges where even washing to 10k wasn’t 100% commonplace. All of us know players who only had 8k HP even at 200. All of us have first characters well below 20k, let alone 30k, and that was considered normal, not discouraging.

At no point was having an even 12k character at the time seen as wildly disadvantaged until a couple years ago. All of us stuck around and eventually built our way up, and clearly we all found it rewarding or else we wouldn’t be here posting trying to explain this.

It’s mostly newer players from the HP Challenge era that are demanding 30k or bust and seeing less as a disadvantage. Most of us still play characters that are not 30k, myself included, and none of us see it as an issue.

It’s not that we “want others to suffer” or however you see it. Most of us don’t see it as suffering. It’s a part of the game like any other. You put in the work, you get the rewards, you feel satisfaction.

 

I've been playing for like 8 years and still don't have a 30k character.

 

I only have one and it's a Bucc

 

Personally I've joined ML only like 4-5 months ago, so I have no idea how it was before, but playing OG Maple since launch and having played for over 15 years now, my primary main was a NL, which eventually caused me to learn about washing. Which is alot more difficult without being able to leech all the way to 120.
Though after Ultimate Explorer was released + the stat caps were increased, with the UA HP/MP exploit, it was quite easy to get a 60K+ (you'd get +500 HP/MP per relog until you left the starting map).

I also don't think in it's current form on ML that washing is alot of work, but rather a huge time gate because of the NX requirement.

What's wrong with trying to get an alternative method of reaching the same point as you'd get with washing as long as it has the same amount effort/time gating?
It's not to make washing obsolete, but provide characters that have far exceeded the level to wash, a possibility to still reach the same level of stats somehow (as I've said before X amount of stats per week doing a challenge/quest/boss, possibly costing Y amount of NX).

 

Really don't see why we can't just implement what ovv suggests with the repeatable quest for challenges players.

You keep a similarly slow process of gaining HP, but you just don't have to engage with having your stats suck for a huge chunk of levels, which I think is actually fine. Gives you the ability to actually play the game, do challenge quests, then slowly build up more HP after you hit 180 (which is a period with not much character growth to begin with). There's still chance for non-washers to buy leech anyways, especially during the horribly tedious 3rd job range.

Sure, 30k isn't technically necessary to have, but people love min-maxing and knowing their character isn't locked in potential for arbitrary reasons. Do we really need to preserve the tedious and lame as shit "remaking and sitting on rope with 400+ int" process just because others dealt with it?

This is coming from someone who is already fairly deep in the washing process for multiple characters and will likely never touch the challenges again if it remains the same. It doesn't really affect me one way or another, but it'd be nice if newer/future players didn't have to deal with it.

 

In terms of sweaty meta game efficiency that’s the “correct” way to play the game. The actual correct way to play is to pick a class you like, or think would be interesting and venture out into the maple world. Compare the HP you would have unwashed to the HP you will have on challenges. HV said it correctly earlier: “if there was no cap would you try and wash forever?”

Rather than having a flat NX cost what if the MP tokens were unlocked via the challenge system itself. There are several tasks players can do for each tier, but only a few are required to unlock the next tier.

 

Not enough to kill the server, clearly. Let's assume players fall into three categories regarding washing. Those who are true casuals and don't need to wash, and understand this, and simply do not wash. Those who are more hardcore, learn the ins and outs of washing, and go through the motions of setting up their infrastructure to wash over long periods of time. Both of these groups are quite happy on the server as is. And finally, there those who simply do not want to go through the process but feel as if they are missing out by not doing so. These are the types of players you mention that are likely to quit, and I'm sure they find another server without washing or another game and are much happier there, and the community and server continues on without them.

There is nothing wrong with having players be unhappy with the game and quit. Every game has a portion of their playerbase that says "this isn't for me" and leaves to go do something else, and that's totally fine. It's evident that the current flow of players still seems to be in a relatively healthy state, so trying to use the arguments of "lots of players are quitting over this" doesn't really hold water. There is no world in which some players are not quitting over something.

It has been explained multiple times throughout this thread what "the work" entails. If it's simply solving captchas and waiting, then that sounds pretty easy to me and should be no problem for you to partake. You're trying to make it seem like it's trivial, and yet in the same breath say you do not want to do it because it's too bothersome.

Again, as I literally just explained, many players do not find the process of washing to be tedious, or annoying, or suffering, or however many adjectives you want to use to describe it. Some may describe it as satisfying, fulfilling, rewarding, or a number of other adjectives. The point being that it's subjective, and you find it tedious and annoying. Which is fine, because there are alternatives you can do instead.

With the obvious caveat that players pre-HPC literally could not play the game in certain contexts. Nobody argued against HPC. With HPC, you are no longer locked out from anything.

 

https://youtu.be/AnM65VLHZrM?si=tnGJ1B9sst2CHnx4

Palladino and fartsy already predicted this post when they released this song

 

Man it's been too long since we've had a new papadino banger.

 

I’m sorry if this comes across as rude but I’ve mentioned this four times now including the post you replied to. I genuinely do not know how to make this point any clearer. If it’s not clear to you, that is entirely on your own reading comprehension.

Yes. Washing a non-30k character is one of the few times in the game where you have to make actually impactful decisions that will affect you long term.

Deliberately deciding what to concede and where to compromise, balancing your current and incoming NX balance, when you want to use the character, and what resources you have access to. Washing to 30k once you have infinite NX or just having the ability to go to 30k HP at will removes the decision making, because now none of your choices matter. You just end up with 30k anyways.

My own personal main was washed out in 4 months after I made the character. I didn’t know about MP washing until level 70. I had limited funds, limited ability to farm NX, and no starting NX bank whatsoever. Learning how to wash properly, calculating how far my small NX bank from 3 months of voting could go and how far I could extend it with incoming NX based on my leveling rate and event APR.

All of this factored into my choice to choose a specific HP value to wash to, and a level to wash out at. And the end result is a character that I specifically created, unique to me, my needs, and my resources, instead of some template cookie cutter character everyone else has. To me, creating this, making these decisions (and trade offs) was meaningful and the end result was rewarding, specifically because I was forced to make concessions. This was a character with a story. My choices mattered.

I know there are plenty of other players who share this journey on the server and similarly find the decision making and planning that goes into washing when you have limited NX to be meaningful and rewarding, because some of them are also speaking on this thread and agreeing with me.

 

Yeah but what about the new players who might not like it?

 

In my opinion, washing shouldnt be the way to have fun or play the game, it is not a mechanic, it is an exploit.
Satisfying? Definitely! But fun? Not at all. Saying that it is part of the game is a bit ironic in my opinion.
As for “new players who dont care about washing,” its not that they dont care because they are not interested in the extra stats, but because they dont want to spend months and months or even years on it.