Let's talk about washing too

While I like this idea and support it, this doesn't very much help the few who are 190 or 200.
EDITx2: whoops pretend i didnt write that

In order to remove MP, you must have more points put into HP or MP than you've reset away.
(e.g. You dumped a total of 15 points into HP; you can only reset away MP up to 15 total times)
The higher level players don't have many opportunities to remove that MP, unless they've bloodwashed.

I suppose the cheap and dirty solution would be to make a Level 200 ring that grants HP.

EDIT: none of this shit applies to me, just playing the inevitable complainer
i wouldnt mind if this was actually implemented

EDITx3: gonna wave my monster internet dong and unrelatedly state that i have never leeched once in my 142 levels

 

Regardless of how players will react, positively or negatively; i'm going to say thank you for attempting to address this issue. I have always found it to be a mechanic that prevented players from enjoying the game fully and further promoted the use of leeching.

 

Yes, you could do that, but if you choose to wash this way, you gain the minimum HP possible for the certain class type.

 

That could work, though the cycling process would take longer than normal.
Everything I just said before is now void.

i am a dumb

 

How about instead of adding that extra mp towards max mp pool, how about simply adding it to the hp instead? I just feel like using 2 resets to increase the hp seems too much

 

i like this idea. it gives people who are willing to put more effort into washing a bonus, while making base INT or INT gears not entirely needed. if we do implement the quests or drops, should it be something like the pet jump quest that is available to everyone? or should it rather be something more akin to a horntail prequest (or even an endgame boss drop) that is accessible only at endgame? I think personally it should be something along the lines of a JQ? but it's hard to implement anything along these lines without being jarring to the MapleLegends' environment. the reason I said JQ as an example is that it's equally accessible and equally difficult for everyone, but it is of course not a distinct suggestion.

also, would it be something along the lines where you can get 30k hp/mp as any class if you are autistic enough? or will it be capped at a certain amount, only able to do it x amount of times?

edit: or maybe an equally likely drop from all area bosses! that would really re-invigorate the bossing scene!

 

Also, the skill "Improved MaxHP Increase" wouldn't be applied for warriors and buccs.

 

Being able to kill Snack Bar and get one of these unique MP orbs would be awesome. I assume the server you reference is Croosade, and if so, one of their things they introduce that I like is a percent chance of success for the Orbs. I think that should be something looked into also. Gives it that "Nostalgic" feel like scrolling has. But for me personally this helps my Hermit with 4 Base Int, who I have not touched. This would also aid new players looking to start a SIN or Pirate (Bless their hearts) as their first character, instead of fitting to the mold and going Mage like everyone else.

LEGENDS has become Leech Story and a big reason why people are jumping to servers without Leech and without HP wash. I think NL's should be rewarded for farming Mushmom's to get Ilbis with also finding these MP Orbs.

 

People are legit noodles if they are washing with int. The only way they can lvl with a washed character that above 8.xhp is to either make a mage or buy leech. Washing in this game promotes leech imo. Get rid of washing and im sure leeching wont be sold for 16m.

 

Reduce ap reset costs

Also, I think it's a good idea to have at least a way of getting more hp/mp without raising base int. I would have definitely prefer if max hp was raised instead but that may be a tad too convenient. Legends may be getting more custom but I suppose if most people in the server enjoys it that's good!

I wonder if there's any other way of making washing slightly faster reduce ap reset costs

 

I agree with this part. also, would it be better or worse if tradeable? if there could be a market for %likelihood, would that add a healthy aspect to our economy? or would we just have high-level area boss farmers dominating the max.MP increase market?

 

First the FM notifications, now this!! We full Croosade now boiz@@!@! I like that your suggestion is the MP route so it keeps washing intact and not standardized. I'd love to have these mp gain items given from quests. Not enough people quest in this server to appreciate the polish of the server and all the funny shit NPCs say. SeemsGood

 

I do like the idea of an item giving hp/mp but there's definitely a lot of nuances about it. One idea I had about washing was reducing the amount of mp needed per reset or increasing the amount of mp gained per level. For example if I play pirate, I need 16 extra mp above minimum mp per wash. This would mean I need ~160 INT if I want to be guaranteed 1 wash per level. My damage takes a hit if I pump INT, and buying INT gear is fairly expensive for a new player. However if the formulas were changed to something like 10 extra mp per wash, and the amount of mp I gained per level is 2-3 extra, the amount of INT I need is somewhat reduced. These aren't exact numbers and I'm sure someone could figure out fair values if this became a thing.

DISCLAIMER: I know that this idea probably requires altering code and whatnot and isn't the most plausible solution but it's just something I've had on my mind.

 

Thank you for bringing this issue to the front burner again.

I like the idea of an item that can increase one's MP when used. It will definitely combat the need to pump a bunch of base INT or have loony amount of MP gear.

In terms of how this item could be made available, I think that it ought to have multiple ways of being obtained if we want to make the community a little more "vibrant" (hard to figure out a good word here). The following are just ideas and feedback on how to implement it.

Boss drops are a good idea. I think that any area boss (like Mano) or instanced boss (like Zak) should have the chance of dropping them, but the odds of dropping them should be based on the relative difficulty of the boss. E.G., good luck getting it to drop from Mano, but HT or Castellan Toad would be very likely to drop one (or multiple) of this item.

What also came to mind would be getting them from redoing Jump Quests. Off the top of my head, I don't know which JQs can be retried after completing them (perhaps there can be ways to get access to otherwise unrepeatable JQs?), but this may be another way they could be added in. I have heard enough of the community gripe about JQs, so clearly there has to be some merit to this idea, right? Perhaps there could be two ways the reward could come from them:

1. A player has a chance to receive the MP item upon completing the JQ. Once they receive it, they can't receive it again till the next server day (or something similar).
2. A player has a chance to receive the item upon completing the JQ, but the chance to receive the MP item again on the same server day decreases dramatically each time they get the reward.

Whichever reward method you pick, I think this would make a fair portion of ML users JQ gods or goddesses, haha. I would be partial to the first reward method, as it would encourage a user to do other available and not just master one.

If we want to encourage questing, perhaps they can be rewarded after certain quest milestones are reached.

I'm all for having them be rewards for collecting Monster Cards. It would probably work similarly to rewards from quest milestones.

They could also be randomly rewarded from voting (although it would have to be rare).

To encourage more exploration or killing of less-popular mobs, perhaps there could be an NPC that assigns a quest to collect a certain amount of a random mob etc. (200 cucumbers, Trixter webs, whatever). Completing it would have a chance to get one of these crystals. There would have to be a way to prevent a player from cancelling the quest for a new mob drop so that they don't re-initiate the quest until they get the item they want.

As for the question of whether or not the MP item should be trade-able, I think it should be trade-able for the following reward methods:

• Bosses
• NPC collect quest

They should not be trade-able for these reward methods:

• Random voting reward (to discourage vote abuse for the item)
• Questing (to discourage making low-level quest mules for farming them. The only way I could see them being trade-able from this method is if the rewards began after a high number of quests being completed, like, say, 150 or 200? Numbers can be fiddled with)
• JQ random reward (to discourage JQ farming mules, especially if the first JQ reward method I mentioned above is implemented)

They might be trade-able for this reward method:

• Monster Book (I'm honestly on the fence on this one, but I lean more toward making it so that you can't trade it)

Hopefully some of these ideas are helpful.

 

I think they should be ONE OF A KIND, UNIQUE items. Non-trade. I think until a proper Meso sink is added to the economy outside of trade/shop tax we shouldn't add an item like this into the flow of things since it would be highly sought after, and would create a bigger issue with Boss farming.

Keeping it Unique and One of a Kind means when you get it, you use it. So players aren't just jumping from channel to channel dominating each boss to find these in high succession and stocking up on them. Because if they did we could see an issue with people selling boss timers for MP orb chances. Also with it being Unique and One of a Kind, since there is a limit to what you can use, it goes from "Farming Mushmom for MP orbs" to eventually "Mushmom for Illbis" or no Mushmom at all.

Bosses already play a huge role in the game, so adding these Orbs increases their importance, so you want that increased importance to fall back to the current level quickly, so making them up for trade, kills that possibility.

 

I think the drop idea is towards the right direction, but the reward itself should not be directly related to washing. The reasons being:

1. It doesn't really benefit players that already have washed or reached end-game and do not intend to touch that topic ever again because of how tedious it is.

2. If a character can survive the boss run to use the additional hp/mp, it would mean that they've washed enough already, no? You've already put them through an unpleasant gameplay experience.

Somethings to consider:

1. In order to make this solution also benefit end-game players and active bossers, maybe offer rewards if and only if the combined base hp of the players inside the run exceeds a certain amount. The quality of the reward would be based on how much you've exceeded the cap by. Possible rewards could be higher chance of significantly larger meso bags, max-stat equips dropping, higher drop rate of skill books, boss tickets that can be used to re-enter the dungeon past the daily limit (limited by rarity and untradeable). Alternatively, this could be implemented as a bonus stage that is independent for each member of the expedition. The rewards of the stage would depend solely on their own base hp (or mp for mages).

2. At the start of the game, provide new players with a set of low-level, untradeable equips + int scrolls. This will effectively lower the amount of resources invested into base int and at the same time, allow new players to not worry too much about washing when picking what classes to play. Of course, these scrolls or items should not have nearly enough power as tradeable gear. Examples would be limiting the slots available to scroll or reducing the amount of int provided given upon success. Though this would lower the value of some int-gear, players with funds would still intend to spend additional resources to purchase higher quality int-gear for easier progression and would therefore, not affect prices of int-gear on the higher side of the market.

3. Offer a set of ap resets upon clearance of boss dungeon for the first time? New players would still have to go through washing but it's a lot more forgiving when say they've washed for Zakum and they clear for the first time, they get 10 free resets. When they wash for and clear horntail, they get 20 free resets. Numbers are subject to balance but might be worth considering nonetheless.

 

I think lowering the NX cost (1K NX?) is a great idea as well as implementing some sort of max MP item~

 

I've never washed. It appears to me a gimmick by Neckson to make money (at the very least, an oversight by the programmers). As far as for or against this change, I would put forward that "Nostalgia" is NOT a valid argument. If you are here for the nostalgia, then one of two things is true for you on this server. You either enjoy washing and therefore are enjoying the nostalgia, or you hate washing and subsequently you are hating this part of the nostalgia. We know Neckson made certain changes to the game in order to maximize income. These were the changes nobody liked (e.g. Potential and Miracle Cubes). I don't want to invalidate the work people put into washing, but if Autoassemble's opinion on the matter is shared by enough of the high levels who've done a lot of washing, then I think that should be the direction to go.

I would want to argue that the total HP each class is given per level should be modified so that washing becomes unnecessary and removed. This does, however, cause me some angst because some classes - like warriors, brawlers, and maybe archers - should have the advantage of having more HP than other classes - like thieves and mages. When Neckson made all classes have, effectively, the same set of skills packaged with different color wrapping, the game became stupid. So I'm hesitant to offer a solution either way. All I can say is that I don't like washing - if you need/want more HP, then put AP into HP when you level - as the game seems to have been originally intended outside the "Neckson money grab" mechanic. So I'd be happy with whichever method allows players to increase max HP at the cost of other skills. Only at level 200 should you be allowed to continue maximizing your character - so I'm fully in favor of having a game mechanic that can eventually bring your character to 30k HP/MP, but only if you're level 200 and it can't be dirt simple...you would have to work for it.

EDIT: I also believe there's something about this that gives mages an unfair advantage if this INT bonuses are allowed throughout the game - I might be missing something, but... just an observation.