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Accepted Make Outlaw's Burst Fire Active

Discussion in 'Accepted' started by Imberos, Mar 19, 2023.

  1. Imberos
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    Imberos Horny Mushroom

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    Nov 20, 2018
    7:33 AM
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    Hey all,

    As you may know, Burst Fire is the triple shot that is used by outlaws. At first, the problem with this skill is that it is a direct downgrade to the basic double shot until putting 11 points into its (comparing dpm). Secondly it locks you from using double shot.

    I suggest this skill will become active so outlaws will be able to choose to use it or double shot, like NLs can choose between lucky seven and triple throw of archers can choose between double shot and strafe.

    Edit: I hear people asking for Burst Fire speed buff but that requires some more consideration. In my opinion making the skill active is the least that can be done without considering any balance changes
     
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2023
    • Agree Agree x 8
    • Like Like x 1
  2. LeonardoJF
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    LeonardoJF Zakum

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    Rio grande do Sul - BR
    1:33 AM
    ItzLeo
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    Favela
  3. Siegfried
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    Siegfried Master Chronos

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    9:33 PM
    If it's possible client-wise, sure, I don't see why not as a QoL. That aside, at the very least, it shouldn't take 11 points to make it better than Double Shot-- among the many problems of Outlaws.

    For reference, despite the speed of Gun attacks (which isn't that significant as Claws are also usually Fast speed), it always deals less than the Sin counterpart with Shadow Partner + Critical Throw (that 200% damage is too good...) when keeping in mind potential buffs for Corsairs pre-4th.
     
  4. -ovv
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    -ovv Horntail

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    9:33 PM
    -ovv
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    With challenge system and class reworks in mind, staff should probably take the time to look over all the skills and restructure them so that there isn't some arbitrary minimum level required to attain breakeven effectiveness. This type of logic has been applied in the past to things like Enrage (it used to take like 21 levels before Enrage became better than Rage). I don't see why it shouldn't be applied for others.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  5. Siegfried
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    Siegfried Master Chronos

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    9:33 PM
    I'd like to review this again, since I realised it was sort of my fault this post became a suggestion in the first place.

    I'm sorry. I first suggested Double Shot to be buffed years ago here : https://forum.maplelegends.com/index.php?threads/scaling-pirates-double-shot-properly.11881/

    But, I forgot to take into consideration Burst Fire.

    Obviously, the Burst Fire progression scaling has to be fixed so it's stronger than DS at the start, but, now a new question arises: do we buff Burst Fire further to match the DS's buff of +20% or just fix the progression scaling?

    I'm going to go on a limb here and make some educated guesses based on some math I had made in an earlier post about bullet damage. and say that the gap between Hermits and Outlaws solo damage is still as big, or bigger, because of some findings below.

    Hermits would still out-damage Outlaws even with a no bullet restriction damage upgrade AND potential damage buff, due to the same Critical Throw OP-ness and their new Shadow Partner skill in third job (+2 more lines).

    Ironically enough, Burst Fire is also slower than Lucky Seven. Have a look:

    Lucky Seven/Triple Throw/Drain/Shadow Meso/Normal Attack
    Faster (2): 600ms (-210ms) <== With booster on, Skanda's and Red Cravens (Fast (4)) have this speed.
    Faster (3): 660ms (-150ms)
    Fast (4): 720ms (-90ms)
    Fast (5): 750ms (-60ms)
    Normal (6): 810ms

    Double Shot
    Faster (2): 360ms (-120ms)
    Faster (3): 390ms (-90ms)
    Fast (4): 420ms (-60ms)
    Fast (5): 450ms (-30ms)
    Normal (6): 480ms

    Blank Shot/Burst Fire
    Faster (2): 660ms (-180ms)
    Faster (3): 690ms (-150ms) <== Most, if not, all guns have this speed after Booster (Fast (5) + booster 2)
    Fast (4): 750ms (-90ms)
    Fast (5): 810ms (-30ms)
    Normal (6): 840ms

    To improve Burst Fire, its scaling could be fixed while maintaining the same maximum damage, but its speed could be increased by around 10-20% to align with the Corsair class identity of high speed equating to higher damage per minute (DPM).

    Obviously, we can give it a straight buff like Double Shot, but, DS was already fast to begin with.

    Again, this hinges on the gap between Outlaw and Hermits for the math I didn't do (yet), if it's actually true (probably is, tbh).

    Minor edit add-on:

    Bowman's Strafe is as fast(er) as Burst Fire, lol.

    Strafe/Arrow Rain/Inferno/Arrow Bomb/Normal Attack
    Faster (2): 600ms (-210ms)
    Faster (3): 660ms (-150ms) <== This one if using the Maple Kandiva bows (lv64)
    Fast (4): 720ms (-90ms) <== This one if using the Nisrock-tier bows (lv 100)
    Fast (5): 750ms (-60ms)
    Normal (6): 810ms

    At the higher levels, Burst Fire is only about 4% faster than Strafe, which isn't really fair IMO.
     
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2023
    • Agree Agree x 3
  6. Azer
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    Azer Red Snail

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    6:33 AM
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    I agree with everything
     
  7. bigbutts
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    bigbutts Brown Teddy

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    May 31, 2017
    12:33 AM
    bigbutts
    Pls increase burstfire speed if anything :sorry:
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  8. Siegfried
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    Siegfried Master Chronos

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    Apr 21, 2017
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    9:33 PM
    • Great Work Great Work x 1

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