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Make PQs Great Again

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by Gurk, Apr 16, 2022.

  1. yurain
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    yurain Windraider

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    Long post, maybe too much changes at once. Will need a while to disgest, coming back later.

    Meanwhile, I pefer to sit in FM with my new chair while bonucing up and down the screen in the next patch.

    Now actual feedbacks.

    General

    1. PQs should not drop pouches. It makes the boss split an absolute disaster. I rather rare/normal gacha added/replace to the final reward pool, instead of the 90% shit we are getting. I believe this applies for all PQ rewards other than the lucky oa int 10/60 you get from KPQ/LPQ. Forgot what others have. This makes PQ a much shittier source of income than just grinding.

    2. EXP should not change. The EXP is decent for new players, and old players won't be doing PQ for the exp as well. Just keep this constant for constant sake.

    3. PQ ring shouldn't happen before quest ring, just because I wanted quest ring more ;)

    PQ Specific

    KPQ
    I don't feel any changes needed here. Decent EXP and good shoes that you can use for a long period of time. It is not meant to be end game.

    LPQ
    Exp for this is kinda shit for the high 40s but not the worst, can take a small buff on the exp.
    Mostly done for the glasses as the only eye equip until much later in the game, which is fine I think. Untill NLs want to start to chaos it for luk....

    EPQ
    Exp is pretty good imo.
    For the equip buff, maybe make the earring a 0 slot cash item, that can be laid on top of existing earrings. Since we don't have much NX for earrings anyway, +1 +2 all stats.

    OPQ
    I only ran OPQ once, and it is slow as hell. Maybe I suck but whatever.
    The 3 attack glove is fine, meant to be mid game anyway, maybe cut the number to run to 15 or something, just because I suck at doing OPQ>

    LMPQ
    Never done this before

    MPQ
    The level range is way to too tight 70 to 85, maybe change it to 75 to 95.
    Pendant can be considered as a cash item. It gives tones of hp, which is a huge plus to washing is optional meme and small stats boost is welcome.

    PPQ
    Exp is awesome if you getting carried, other than that, it is meh. Due to the level range, you can have 90+ chars carrying a 5x, which I dont think is balance in a PQ context. Maybe tighten the range to 60 - 85, to give OPQ and MPQ some beathing space.
    Just give the PQ hat 10 slots and let it be the zak hat replacement without accuracy and avoid, if they really hate the zjq so much.
    The chair is nice.
     
  2. OP
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    Gurk Headless Horseman

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    Yeah, that could definitely be a plus, as I suggested for broken glasses. I just didn't want to appear too heavy-handed initially by giving everything like +300 HP.

    I'm honestly not sure how often they drop from the boss but I think it's probably fine given that one would already need only around 15 KPQs to get from 21 to 31 and it would give players a chance to reroll the shoes if they didn't get good stats on it. The shoes from NPC should probably be random stats instead of always average stat under this change though.

    That seems fair. Getting from 51 to 66 would be about 25 runs' worth of exp, which seems like a nice spot for potentially transitioning into PPQ.

    That would imply that all current bossing is an absolute disaster.

    OnionF6

    In any case, I'm not sure in what world "decent" means being more than 3x worse than the second best option for leveling, not to mention "keep this constant for constant sake" in no way constitutes an argument. Furthermore, PQs like OPQ and PPQ have already had their exp changed before here (each boosted by about 50%).

    Okay.
     
  3. xadra
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    xadra Capt. Latanica

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    Best post on the forums since quest ring, I think. This is something that would get me to actually come back and replay this game on a new character.

    To the GMs: making PQs competitive and relevant would go a long, long long way towards silencing the haters calling your servers a leech2win server.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  4. TennGohan
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    TennGohan Brown Teddy

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    As much as the devs hate cpq, I'd like to suggest adding cpq to the server. Easily the best/most fun pq in maple, while being just toxic enough. The main reason they left out cpq is because it was always too good and would pull players away from lpq, but in the current state no one does lpq anyways.
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 7
    • Agree Agree x 1
  5. Cak33
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    Cak33 Headless Horseman

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    Most people would juz trade wins, which kinda defeat the purpose of CPQ
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  6. yurain
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    yurain Windraider

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    Yes. It is not the best leveling option. But if you bump the exp up, then you run into the problem of killing yourself for the PQ equips, which I just rather you don't give me so much exp in the first place. I just find the exp rate currently correspond with the equip's runs needed quite nicely. Boosting exp will upset that balance.
    If you are a new player, the current exp is not that bad. If you are an old player redo-ing PQ on for content or equips, the exp doesn't matter either.

    Just want to keep things simpler for the new players
     
  7. OP
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    Gurk Headless Horseman

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    I specifically mentioned reducing the number of runs for most of the PQ equips to address that exact issue.

    You keep saying the exp is "not that bad" and "decent" but that's entirely arbitrary without a reference point. There are only two other alternatives for leveling at these levels, grinding and leeching, and both of these entirely outclass PQs by several magnitudes. Can you name something else that is worse than all other alternatives by several factors and would still be considered decent?
     
  8. Kmac
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    Kmac Horny Mushroom

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    If you exclusively LPQ at level 35 you will receive broken glasses at ~lvl 43-44. Increasing LPQ exp would allow people to receive their glasses and immediately transition to EPQ. This change would help new players and those who prefer to PQ for levels.

    If people want a second pair of broken glasses and need to kill themselves, that’s their problem.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  9. KurayamiLove
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    KurayamiLove Skelegon

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    I like this, I would also add CPQ too. Now what I think is that people have too much INT to PQ and welp there is always leech.
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 3
  10. Daydreamer
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    Daydreamer Headless Horseman

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    I understand that people are nostalgic for CPQ because it's unique and quite memorable but it's very very prone to wintrading and outclasses all other PQs and questing. I think the one way to make it acceptable is if it were a recurring timed event. For example, CPQ could be available only for the first weekend of the month.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. Camazotz
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    Camazotz Chronos

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    Great post. Nobody asked but here's my opinion:

    I think increasing KPQ exp by nearly 5x would make it hard to find people to run it because people would outlevel it so quickly. Maybe increase it by a smaller amount and add some other incentive? KPQ already seems pretty easy to recruit at the moment anyway.

    MPQ would need to be better than grinding, rather than comparable, for anyone to run it, since CDs drop so many mesos/equips/gach tickets on top of the exp given.

    Also, as someone who didn't wash enough, I would love a way to obtain this "PQ ring" after already surpassing the levels for these PQs (maybe similar to getting PQ boss cards from Tienk in Night Market?). However, I understand this ring is purely hypothetical and the details don't need to be worked out since it isn't even being considered for implementation at this time.

    Last more point I want to make is that one thing holding PQs back is HP washing. PQs are not viable for people who are heavily washing since they can't do any damage and are forced to leech, thus greatly reducing the amount of people running them. If we were able to solve this problem, there would be a lot more people able to PQ.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  12. KurayamiLove
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    KurayamiLove Skelegon

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    So? we can't have old content cos you can abuse something? That to me sounds like all the content in old MS. SE is broken, Avoid is broken, Mages are broken but we draw the line at CPQ. I get the take on this since is kinda like an OP grinding spot that renders useless LPQ, but I think LPQ is already outclassed by grinding or just mage leeching. Perhaps with buffs you could make both viable? but I don't know.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  13. Estrahl
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    Estrahl Mr. Anchor

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    Grinding in general is supposed to be faster than PQing. That's always been the case. PQs are more cost effective because you spend less on potions to gain some exp, you interact with others, and there are bonuses at the end of the run.

    What PQs should give are better incentives. EXP is not supposed to be comparable, you do it because of what I said before

    Edit* Nvm that comment is not on this thread, anyways

    3 reasons why you PQ, by order of importance:

    1. You like it
    2. You want the boss cards/unique pq items
    3. You like the drops
    Currently #3 is pretty much garbage in some cases, especially for the amount of time you invest. Drop tables just aren't that impressive on some pqs

    This leaves just 1 & 2, which are highly dependent on personal interests and goals, since you can hit T10 without doing any PQs, and all the unique PQ items get replaced later on anyways
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 4
  14. Cak33
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    Cak33 Headless Horseman

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    I don't think this is entirely true in regards to KPQ and LPQ. Early levels (20-25 and 35-40) will make you burn lots of potions which cripples your savings as a new player (unless you sell your raggey cape and jump scroll 30% from quests)

    On KPQ, the good reward loots are usually the scrolls which one has to wait in FM to make a sale OR the earrings that can be npced for 25-35k. Rest are some cheap ores that doesn't provide much NPC values, not too sure about FM values. I don't think its possible to make positive meso income from KPQ unless your item gets sold in FM quick.

    Comparing to grinding in general, if you choose your map well I believe you actually earn positive mesos as long you choose a map that doesn't burn your pots too fast, or has good loots (not that I know which has good loots. Fireboar opens up after level 30)

    On LPQ, EXP in my opinion is insanely fast compared to teddies/burning land 5, provided you have an active party willing to go for several rounds. In LPQ, you can sell capes and sundews which provides large income, and occasionally some free 100 pots which helps in meso savings. Meso earning is similar to grinding in burn land 5, which I think is alot considering player-to-player trades are not done.
     
  15. Estrahl
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    Estrahl Mr. Anchor

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    The exp gain certainly isnt garbage, but with the 1-35 in 6 hours guide, plus some of those jump quests(if you're good at them) you actually gain more pots than you spend(and exp) compared to PQing at HPQ and KPQ.

    I've always seen PQs as a cheap but reliable way to gain exp. Since the server isn't terribly reliable(people have lives, not blaming anyone for that), I've not always found PQing to be possible in the moments I play.

    This is coming from someone who loooooves to PQ. I think it's a really fun way to gain levels, and I would play them for hours. But compared to my friends, I was always leveling slower. Not by a terrible amount, only about 5 ish levels by the time I hit 50, but it was definitely noticeable. I would also play more to compensate for their faster leveling.

    Grinding is faster but costs more, but you can also get some nice drops depending on your spot, while PQing is slower but also cheaper, and the drops are not always as good.

    Which is why I think if you're going to PQ you should do it first and foremost because you enjoy PQing, otherwise you will always gain better stuff just grinding.
     
  16. Daydreamer
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    Daydreamer Headless Horseman

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    There's loads of stuff that got removed for just that reason though. Chimney, iTCG, smuggling in PQs, etc.
     
  17. MainSan
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    MainSan Mushmom

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    I wouldn't mind them adding a version of CPQ that don't give any exp. Maybe add some other fun (but useless) reward instead.
    CPQ is a very fun and nostalgic part of the game and its a shame its not getting added just because of potential wintradingSlimeCry
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
  18. Cak33
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    Cak33 Headless Horseman

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    i agree with this.
    maybe have some custom-themed coke pills that cost 1 meso when u sell to NPC, or maybe make it another source of assorted adventurer cape would be nice too.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  19. TennGohan
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    TennGohan Brown Teddy

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    So you want to add another useless pq with terrible (no) exp and meso, that no one will do, just like all the other pqs in the server that need a buff because they have terrible exp and meso...
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
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  20. intimmydator
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    intimmydator Slime

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    Honestly I would Party Quest more if this server had the Party Quest Menu thing that GMS had before just dumping them all into one map. With how Party Quests are currently, you need to invest a large amount of time traveling between continents just to find out no one is there, and then your options are travel to the continent where your best training spot is; or staying at the PQ map for potentially hours at a time and hoping someone shows up while broadcasting Smegas about how many people you still need. If I'm not doing the PQs for the reward but rather to escape grinding, then the projected EXP gain has to be better than 0.00%/hour.

    I should also add as a new player myself, it was very frustrating when I was asking my guild for advice on leveling 50-70, and without fail I was told to "just PQ" as though I could magically pull participants out of my butt. My only solutions for the PQ problem would be either extending the level range by about 5 levels, as in Ellin PQ could be 45-60, or OPQ could be 51-75, etc. and keeping KPQ and LPQ as is; or adding in the PQ travel NPC like mentioned.
     
    • Like Like x 4

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