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FM shop space...

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Lionheart, Apr 10, 2017.

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  1. Lionheart
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    Lionheart Horntail

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    As we get more and more players, I think it's important to notice this trend:

    FM01: 100%
    FM02: 100%
    FM03: 100%
    FM04: 100%
    FM05: 100%
    FM06: 100%
    FM07: 100%
    FM08: 30%
    FM09: 35%
    FM10: 90%
    FM11: 90%
    FM12: 90%
    FM13: 50%
    FM14: 60%
    FM15: 95%
    FM16: 95%
    FM17: 20%
    FM18: 80%
    FM19: 70%
    FM20: 70%
    FM21: 15%
    FM22: 25%

    This is the overall state of the FM rooms' capacity as observed just before Kimberly gave out GM buffs. Many rooms are full or nearly full. Every single room has shops now.

    This presents a number of problems: first, with more and more players coming to the server, how is anyone supposed to browse the whole FM in a timely manner? I get that some of you guys are in love with the "nostalgia" but quite frankly this bazaar trading style has got to be one of the most boring, time consuming activities when it comes to trying to just buy one kind of item or scroll.

    Some of you might love it, but I am feeling rather overwhelmed at this point. And forget browsing through the shops to check on the price of numerous things just to get an accurate value for a price check! Aint nobody got time fo dat.

    The second issue is more obviously the space: when or if we get a few hundred more players on this server, all these FM rooms will fill up. The obvious solution to this problem is to simply have players set up shop in channel 2, rinse and repeat the same process... and fill up more FM rooms. One small problem with this, however, is that the owl of minerva cannot warp you to a different channel. At least it can still search all channels...

    But also, by time we get to that point when player shops are spilling over into channel 2, I think we'll have an utterly ridiculous amount of shops.

    Don't you think it's time for a change?
     
  2. Eeko
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    Eeko Timer

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    I don't see a problem in having a blooming economy. I'm extremely happy that the server is growing and with more players, comes more supplies. If you really are bothered that you can't go through FM in a timely manner (lol) then just buy an owl. Buy 2 if you have to. I love foraging through fm and seeing what I can find. This is great.
     
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  3. Prophet
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    Prophet Master Chronos

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    Maybe add a feature to owls that let you warp to shops in other channels? If we ever get to the point where shops are spilling over to ch2, I think people are probs gonna just spam @@@@@ messages in the fm entrance.

    Personally I like browsing shops without looking for an item in particular, but yeah its starting to take almost half an hour to get through all the shops OnionConfused
     
  4. Number32
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    Number32 Skelegon Retired Staff

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    It tells you where the shop is though, so you can just go there :D
     
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  5. Kimmy
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    Kimmy Administrator Staff Member Administrator Game Moderator

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    This is nothing yet. in GMS you had to surf through 22 full FM rooms in 20 channels.

    Also, people had these non-hired merchants where your character AFK, which cluttered it even more.
     
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  6. MapleBento
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    MapleBento Slimy

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    I'm assuming this is a post to gather suggestions and opinions since there was no solution presented other than changing it somehow.

    Talking about the time it takes to search the FM to gather prices or find items and saying it takes too much time and that nobody has time for that seems a bit odd to me. This game is literally a time sink. You grind for fourth job until the end, whether that's 200 or you quitting, and you grind bosses for gear. Mights as well "grind" the FM while you're at it. Prices don't change so often that you need to refresh your price list once a week. If even once a month. So browsing the market for an hour to two hour a day, once a month, for the benefit of your selling capabilities and wallet which is technically an option, not a necessity, doesn't sound so bad. To me at least.

    As you might be able to tell, I'm against changing how it is. However, I do seem to recall somebody mentioning the WoW style of bazaar where you can see all the items in one big menu and search for what you need and bid on it or auto purchase it. I don't really think the devs would spend time doing that as this is mainly a nostalgia server despite there being content that isn't v 0.62 already implemented.

    Maybe the devs could just fix owl to change your channel for you? That would solve a big problem. What I've always done when using an owl is writing down the name and location of the shops on a piece of paper or on a doc and just referring back to it. More effort, yes, but effective.

    I don't have a solution to satisfy you but I hope you can find one in your thread. These are my thoughts.
     
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  7. OP
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    Lionheart
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    Lionheart Horntail

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    I'm just saying, with the amount of people we have now, searching through the whole FM once is quite a tedius and boring process that takes up a lot of time. It seriously kills my will to play.

    Hordes of people all shouting at the same time and having hundreds of shops to sift through is not the same thing as a "blooming economy". You know what would really be a blooming economy? Being able to easily buy things you want and being able to easily sell things you don't want. And this bazaar system is anything but easy. We may have the people, we may have the currency and the the supply of goods, but we sure as hell do not have an efficient system of trading.

    Well I have played on different GMS servers where the worst it got was to channel 2. I don't ever remember seeing it that bad. Did you play at a different time or different server? Maybe? I still don't believe it because you had to actually pay real money for these shop permits or hired merchants, and then they expired. So not every player had access to these.

    A better point to argue is: is this how you want the market to go, copying GMS again? I thought you were all into removing tedious things from the game? Well, I'm telling you now, having to search through the hundreds of shops is tedious.
     
  8. Kimmy
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    Kimmy Administrator Staff Member Administrator Game Moderator

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    Economy and the shops is one of the most important aspect of any Private Server, and often when someone joins the server they ask the user how the economy is and if many items are available. As other said in the topic its only good more shop are appearing, and the way they work now is how I think they should be. There's owl , and the whole purpose of owl was to pay nx to have it less tedious, aka the telerocks you kept suggest for boats.
     
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  9. Eeko
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    I haven't had any encounters with "hordes of people all shouting at the same time" trying to sell things and I haven't had a problem buying and selling equips that I'm looking for. I'm sure whatever you're looking to buy is out in the market right now. Spend some time looking for it. That is all.
     
  10. OP
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    Lionheart
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    Lionheart Horntail

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    You seriously haven't seen people spamming in the FM yet? Or does having to look at all the FM shops technically not count?

    Actually, I had a whole bunch of scrolls I wanted to sell, and I wanted to price them competitively but not be completely ripped off...

    In the end I just said "fuck it" and gave it my best guess, cause I didn't want to go through the FM writing down all the prices I saw. Even the owl of minerva won't show you the scrolls that have already been sold.

    And this is the whole problem. Not only does this hurt the buyer, but it also hurts the seller, because let's say you've got your shop open out in the boonies in FM 15... ahaha, how many people do you think actually go there? Not as often as, say, FM1.

    If it's a pain in the ass to find what you are looking for, that conversely means when you try to sell something, it's a pain in the ass for everyone else to find what you're selling.
     
  11. Eeko
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    Your concerns are silly imo. Maplestory has always had a crazy filled market. I'm sure you're an old ML player and are used to fm only going to 1-6 and maybe 7-8, but with a growing player base this is bound to happen, especially if we get free nx everyday.
     
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  12. Kimmy
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    Kimmy Administrator Staff Member Administrator Game Moderator

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    Spamming the FM is something I have nothing against of. There's an other server that outright banned people for spamming in a free MARKET which is beyond silly to me. The Free Market was always meant to sell items, and spamming what you are B> or S> was always part of the place. Yeah, you can warp to it now and see it as a 'hang out' place, but the FM to me was never a hangout place and it was a place to sell and buy items, which is why I do not ban people for 'spamming' sales in the FM.
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2017
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  13. Heartiess
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    Can always start with stores closing when their items are sold out (sometimes people have 3 or 4 scrolls, sell them all yet dont "organize" their stores so it stays ope ed without any actual available items)
     
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  14. Buccaneer
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    Buccaneer Horny Mushroom

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    I don't see how this is a problem at all :p Gameplay for each player is different, and to be honest, I think there are too little shops in the FM now! To some, you may have a hard time finding a certain item, but that's not really the case - there is just more items in general.

    If you are a player like me, I honestly spend 1/2 my time in FM instead of training and bossing. I love to just go through each shop to see what deals I can nab and sell :) I don't think this is a problem at all and owls solve the problem of those who don't want to look through FM.
    (Random side note: The reason why some further FMs [10 - 12] have more shops then say FM 8 or 9 is because around 1 day ago, the server reset which means that around that same time 1 day later, the people that haven't reset their shops will all be closed.)
     
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  15. lforlalaland
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    lforlalaland Brown Teddy

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    Firstly, 'Tedious' is subjective. If you can sit through and grind to get to 146 doing such roto tasks over and over again, I don't see how walking through FM once is tedious. If you look as carefully as I do, you will about an 40 mins to finish FM once. I do my FM rounds on an average of 3-4 times a day. Well, you might argue that I'm a merch but you don't see others complaining. Moreover, the FM 15 vs FM 1 point you have brought across is what makes getting an FM 1 spot that much more lucrative and desirable. Honestly, I don't see any wrong with current FM system as it is and as Kim pointed out, it was 20 channels of 22 FMs to run through back in the day without the luxury of Owls because they cost real money. Lastly, if it kills your will to play just because you are lazy to run through FM even when you have tele, then that's your choice.
     
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  16. United
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    when we were around 150 player base we had 1-4 full all the time 7-8 full 13 and 18 full...
    so you got now 5 6 9 10 11 14 15 19 20 that almost all the time full... lets say we doubled it i guess.
    i really dont see the probs, you either scout half of free market like we used to do and hope to get "lucky" or you go full merch and scout it all...

    tbh i didnt scout free market for days now and i still sell my gach scrolls and farming, simple either i use the price i know and at the worst case get 500k less, (if the price rise) or the scroll doesnt sell, for days (so you lower the price)
    there is another choice of... just ask your friends?
    every1 has the one full fm hoe friend (DulceDulce ) who doesnt leave and know all prices... so you ask him what this scroll worth.

    i really really do not see a problem now fm isnt really full, you can always find spot in the less wanted rooms.
     
  17. OP
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    Lionheart
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    Lionheart Horntail

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    Grinding and going through the FM shops are two completely different activities, and they really do require a different kind of concentration. But yes, tedious is indeed subjective, and therefore you have no right handwaving it away as equivalent and inconsequential because I achieved a high level. Especially when you don't even know me or how I play.

    40 minutes is a LONG time to try and get a basic price of some items, and it would only get longer. Compare that to an auction house system on another kind of MMO, and looking up a single item takes just a few seconds. That is 40 minutes wasted I'd rather be doing something else, worse than boat ride time wasting since I can't even alt tab or do something else in the mean time.

    The "problem" I am trying to point out is that while it "works", things will only get more cumbersome as (or if) more players join the server. Compare having to try and search for a specific book in an old, dusty library, to just typing its title in the search engine of Amazon. The technology and means to facilitate trade on this server already exist, and even more ideas could be implemented. Just a little while ago, there was a topic about owls. Yet we don't want to make trading faster, better, more accurate and fairer because... nostalgia.

    And yeah, I like to try and have an idea of prices myself, because having to ask other people all the time is annoying.
     
  18. Huiae
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    Huiae Headless Horseman

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    what I really hope to say on this topic is, just move ur lazyass...... or just give it up (like me).

    i do know keeping price knowledge of many stuffs and shop spot in fm1 requires pretty hard effort (which i can't do). why every ppls including both deligent and lazy should be treated as "same" and be fair for everythings? sorry, i can't understand.

    yes. my playstyle is less than 1% of my playtime in FM (usually, for me, FM is place to xfer pot/gears or meet someone instantly, instead of market place) , so i never scan FM nor set shop to sell stuffs. if I have something to buy so need to scan FM? no, i don't like it. so I just ask help to other ppls who scan fm (really appreciated! <3) , while scanning, check stuffs which i want, or just owl. I think it's fair. I didn't spend time for merching. so it's sure thing that I'm lack of info related with market.
     
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2017
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  19. Soblet
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    I used to use basilmarket instead of going through the fm which worked great for me. Fm was either overpriced or sold out unless you either spend alot of time or get really lucky.

    Maybe something similar would be possible?
     
  20. Colin
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    Colin Orange Mushroom

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    Throwback to last summer when only FMs 1-4, 7, 13, and 18 were even partially occupied MapleF18
     
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