Make HP Washing Optional

The ammount of bias by players that haven't washed is funny. Oh well, shit won't change so it doesn't matter xd

 

You can say whatever you want, It won't change things, hp washing is here to stay, deal with it. Removing it won't make the server better, it will just make it lose players and make things easy. But keep asking for it to be removed, go ahead, I don't really care either way.

 

OP, can you name me a server that has successfully gotten rid of HP washing? Genuinely curious if people actually actively play it (not sarcasm).
Most of the ones Ive heard of that have tried to find solutions (automatically adding more HP per level, etc) have either closed or have very little players.

 

Kim already said that hp washing is here to stay... I don't understand why people can't get that into their heads.

 

Interesting, however they're EXP gain is also 4x ours, leaving very little time to HP wash to begin with (vs our 2x rates, longer to level, more time to develop a character).

Im pretty neutral on this matter in general, ive played MapleLegends for over 2 years now and have never washed a character. I still horntail quite regularly on my bishop and have a buccaneer that has enough hp (with HB) unwashed to HT at level 131 - therefore, ill definitely have enough hp to HT at lvl 155. You definitely aren't "forced" (even if its in quotation marks) to HP wash to boss. You ALWAYS have the option to opt for another class (warrior, bucc, bishop) since they have the advantage of HP gain / MG.

I agree that if you chose to select a stronger class such as Drk, NL or BM, you should have other challenges, like washing. As for HP per level, I believe it is way too late to implement unless you consequently increase the HP of every single player whos already washed / leveled past level 1, individually. It would literally require a wipe or a new server.

As for decreasing mob damage, I think its absolutely obtainable to reach HP required for horntails CURRENT DAMAGE (EASILY as mentioned by others) if you set your priorities right.

At the end of the day, you chose everything: Class, HP wash or not HP wash, Gachapon, Merch, Hairstyles, Grind vs Leech vs Quest, etc. There are so many OTHER aspects of the game that don't involve horntail, and MapleLegends is definitely not centered around Horntail. If you wish to achieve a certain goal in the game, you must accept and take the steps required to achieve it.
I will not accept the statement that "so many people" quit due to hp washing.

 

HP washing is indeed achievable, optional and not a necessity, and I agree that it is all about choices, and make proper planning for your choice.

Let's for a moment, limit the discussion on those who choose to hp wash.
If you choose to wash, you have to work for it.
So let's say reduce the price of AP resets, what happened?
1) Unfair to those who have washed
2) Causes extra customization of the features (but this isn't a 100% vanilla 0.62 server already)

The staff proposed to reduce the AP reset price, and was met with negative response because of sudden announcement, and lack of discussion and feedback from the community, hence discussion and thread like this is very necessary and important.

My stand is on reducing the AP reset price to <insert an appropriate amount, and this needs extensive discussion as well>.
What about those who have washed? You do realise for those have washed, if they have desire to make new character, they too benefit from it, do you?
Of course it's unfair, those spent NX can't be recovered, but what is fair? Don't expect life to be fair. Is RNG itself fair?

So what's the benefit of this? Lowering the amount of waiting for vote NX of course. Some may think this is fair or unfair, arguing you have to work for it and not lowering the price.

Then how about lowering it a little, but not too much?
How much is too much? This have to be discussed thoroughly also.

Any new changes, there will be people affected, hence, changes should be implemented gradually, and not drastic changes, something like a buffer.
I would suggest reducing the AP reset price by a suitable amount first.

Ok my opinion is biased maybe, because I haven't washed. But if I do washed before this, my opinion will still be the same.

P/S: In discussion, can we agree not to use sarcasm, or personal attacking anyone (not hinting or pointing finger at anyone who have done this). Counter the opinion with arguments, attack the idea, don't attack the person giving the idea.

 

I agree with this suggestion and I have washed in both of my characters. I know how painful it is and demotivating, especially when you're forced to wait to be able to HP wash because you can only buy 1 AP Reset every 24 hours, so you just have to play a mage in the meantime, otherwise you're gonna be useless either way if you play a class and you decide to wash without the NX required to do so.
I think people who say that the server would lose players if HP washing wasn't a thing are completely clueless when it comes to game design, this is exactly one of the flaws in older versions of maple and Neckson addressed this issue in later versions. Not only that, but also the skill balance is so bad in the old versions of maple that even the pservers are addressing that issue themselves, or some of them.
- The real reason why people, including myself, prefer old version of MapleStory:
Because of the training pace, the Party Quests (One of the best features of MapleStory) which was completely removed in later versions, and the very few classes. It's not because the skill balance is terrible and it sure as hell isn't because you have to waste time and money on AP Resets to become a useful character.

Unfortunately, they don't understand that nobody likes HP Washing and that it should never be an obligation, so we'll have to deal with it... Anyway, making it optional like you suggested or even completely fix it, not only would improve the game, but it would also encourage more people to play the game, since they could finally pick their favourite class without having to worry about not being good enough later on.

mettzi to prove them wrong, you should create a poll:
Would you play if the game didn't have the dumb mechanic called 'HP Washing'?
Options: Yes / No
And then we'll see who's right

 

hp rings pls

 

If hp washing was an unintentional feature by Neckson doesn't that mean that Neckson never intended for low hp characters such as Nls and BMs to do horntail in the first place? You should be thankful this feature exists so that if you pick an attacking class, you can even attempt Horntail.

 

If it was fixed, you could attempt Horntail regardless. Now if you don't HP wash you're still dependent on Hyper Body, meaning if you play with friends and none of them picked Dark Knight, you won't be able to enjoy end game content with them without having to add a random just because you need their buff. Also, in the official game NX was obtainable with real money, so this was never intended and they eventually fixed it. This is a BUG, not a game feature

 

Just a comment from the perspective of a new member of Legends. I joined Legends with three real life friends. We were super excited to play different classes (I was the bishop; they would be DK, assassin, and buccaneer). We all started playing, excited to level and one day get to do awesome endgame bosses together.
- Well, then we learned about HP washing. One of my friends quit before he hit 3rd job. He wanted to play a Pirate; he didn't want to have to make a mage to fund himself to make washing possible/efficient. Because he couldn't, he chose to go to another server which would be more balanced. Does Legends want to turn away new players for this reason?
- Another friend decided to leech off me. We were going to level together and have fun together. Instead, he had to pump points into INT and I carried him all the way to 2nd job, which was extremely boring and tedious. Again, we were all new; we had no funding, no equips.
- 3rd friend also quit eventually. Keep in mind I tried very very hard to convince all of them to stay. He said explicitly that he personally hates not being "optimal" whenever he plays games (this kind of mindset is REALLY common for gamers, it's a big deal. Even the IDEA that one day your character won't be able to access endgame content is enough to turn people off, even if they never get there). The only way he could be "optimal" was to make a bishop to fund his attacker so he could actually play the class that he wanted. And even then, he wouldn't be able to enjoy it properly until he was way higher level, making all the early to mid-game content very difficult and tedious work.
- In the end, the only person who stayed with Legends out of my group of friends was me. Why? Because I actually like bishops, and I had wanted to be a bishop from the start. I got lucky that my favorite class is also the meta class.

1) It lessens class diversity.

• Funding makes hp washing way easier (through obtaining INT equips), and the meta way to get more funding is to make a bishop. Trying to wash a sin for your first character with zero funding is impossible to do efficiently.
• Mages don't have to wash. People say this helps balance things. Well, the server in its current state is clearly not balanced (huge population of priests/bishops), and is skewed in favor of classes that don't need HP washing.
• Theoretically, washing might only take a few months of voting. Well, you also have to multiply the cash spent/the time spent by 2 when calculating the costs in order to take into account the opportunity cost of all of that cash. A new bishop character made at the same time that you make your character will have had months more of cash to spend on gach and amass funds while you were saving up for wash. Moreover, all that time could have been spent playing in, voting for, and having a good time on a different server instead.

2) It creates a barrier to entry for new players who don't want to play mages.

• Exploitation of game mechanic: it's not built into the game. Unless you're a maple vet, you don't really have any idea it exists. By the time you figure it out, you might have already spent a bunch of hours on your character. Again this might make you quit and want to join a different server.
• "It's not that hard/make a new character/etc." Well, my friends (and a lot of people my age) have full-time jobs, and voting every single day for months just for one character is super time-consuming. They play Maple to have fun, not to grind away as a bowman with 80 INT while having zero funds from gach/leech. They want to actually be able to do the quests and fight the monsters they're meant to at their character's level, and enjoy early to mid-game content. Otherwise, they'd have to make a priest/bishop for funds, which, again, would take lots of time.
• People with funds have an advantage. They can get INT equips, and maybe other equips to make up for high base INT. New players won't have this.

Finally, HP washing sucks. Like, it just does. It's not fun. It doesn't build community. It encourages leeching, harms class diversity, and discourages real team play among different classes.

So, should the server value accessibility, attracting new (possibly more casual) players and class diversity more? Or should the server value "fairness" for the vet players and maintaining their loyalty/investments more?

 

You said it all.
You should be entitled to pick your favourite class and enjoy training with it since level 1 without having to depend on other people because you have to add INT to your stats when your class doesn't even require INT. And I also know people who quit the game because of HP Washing, it just doesn't make any sense at all to have this in the game.

 

feel like the owner needs to play the game having 100 base int without funding on a night lord from levels 1 to 150

 

I can totally relate to this.
I decided to spend years accumulate NX to wash for my future assassin, even though most probably I won't have the time to do bossing anymore by the time I finish washing it due to family commitment.
This is a kind of perfectionist mindset which I can totally relate to.