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Accepted & Implemented Reduce CWK Signs to One Per Job

Discussion in 'Accepted' started by Pundit, Apr 11, 2021.

  1. Soblet
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    Soblet Zakum

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    You don't run any PQs because it's a waste of time yet you would be sad if people didn't ask you for signs anymore because you wouldn't get into CWK anymore (which is a waste of time btw). You can't complain about a homogenised maple experience while refusing to do anything even somewhat suboptimal. Well you can but you know..
     
    • Agree Agree x 5
  2. Annolis
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    Annolis Skelegon

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    I'm looking at it from the perspective of OPQ and MPQ. Players will LPQ if they feel the glasses and the experience is worth it. For OPQ, those gloves are only good if the scrolling of them afterward is superior to a BWG that you can farm faster, therefore the experience to time invested is the only draw for OPQ - which, from what I've heard, isn't. MPQ used to have no incentive at all until the pendants for MPQ became equal to or superior to the Deputy Badge. Prior to this, only questers would seek out a party for MPQ. The main difference between LPQ/OPQ/MPQ and CWKPQ is there is no level limit to CWKPQ. While nobody would LPQ/OPQ/MPQ for mesos, they might for the equip, but definitely will for the exp. If CWKPQ doesn't draw enough attention, the question becomes, why? Are players looking for mesos, equips, exp, or something else? Now, I haven't done a lot of of CWKPQ, so I'm not familiar with the bonus drops at the end. I am aware of the MoN and the Taos to make those stars (which I've heard are obsolete even though it takes a ridiculous amount of Black Crystals to make them), and the Ssiws Cheese, but beyond that, I don't know why people would want to do CWKPQ. I've been told the experience is terrible. I hear MoNs don't sell for a lot and there are guilds that will gladly run the PQ for free for their guildies to get MoNs. So... what would make people want to do this PQ more often?

    Perhaps if the bosses started dropping their Monster Cards? Perhaps if the experience was on the level of Zakum? If the incentives are there, the signs will naturally come.

    [BTW, I'm deliberately not mentioning the pouches because I don't think those should be the main draw either. I think they should drop because they fall into the nature of where Pouches come from (bosses), and CWKPQ should be no different. The fact that they don't drop any is an incentive to do something else with your time.]
     
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  3. -ovv
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    -ovv Horntail

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    Yes? Like I said before, I don't really care if this gets implemented or not, but I think the current format of requiring 2x of each class is cool, and it's a relic of old showing that this PQ used to require multiple parties to clear. It's a restriction no other PQ or content has in this game. Simply removing it because people do not want to pre-plan/ask around for help seems weird to me.

    This is akin to someone asking for GPQ to be open to non-guildmates. Outside of a useless Guild Point leaderboard, GPQ has nothing to do with guild affiliation, yet opening it up to non-guildmates for the sake of inclusion and access seems weird.

    Content goes through various life cycles in a server. Look at the history of Zakum as content in this server. When server was first launched, defeating Zakum was difficult and an accomplishment. Guilds formed to coordinate multiple party runs so that people could say they've run Zakum, and the lines to loot your own helmet were long. Higher level players would hop into Zak runs to get their lower leveled guildmates helmets, and it became an unspoken system where if you got a helmet through your guild, you could return the favor when you got to a higher level yourself. Years passed, HT was released, and Zakum became dead content. "Zak is ban" became a meme, and "R> Zak" was thrown around as a joke. Then the server became so strong that Zakum stopped being considered bossing content altogether and just a means to get skillbooks, helm, and certs - all which ended up being purchasable through services. Now, with pouches dropping, it's become content to farm coins in solo, duo, or trio comps, despite its 6-man minimum requirement.

    What I personally miss is content that brings people together to do things suboptimally. Whether it's hunting a Zak helmet for a guildmate, running a 30 man Horntail to get a guildmate their MW20, or running CWKPQ randomly because someone needed an extra. NT coin muling was just that - an active chatroom with a mix of your friends and your friends' friends - with the incentives of getting free coins.

    Let me sum up my perspective with a question:
    Should we be changing content so that there needs to be fewer and fewer instances where people need help from each other?

    upload_2022-3-31_1-20-20.png
     
    • Like Like x 2
  4. Estrahl
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    Estrahl Mr. Anchor

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    I will say the main draw for me is nostalgia. I mean go figure with the server and all, I guess it makes sense when you think about it.

    I think fun should always be the priority in these, but I do find maybe something to work towards or fill out the gaps is a great thing as well.

    All of the pqs have fun for me, that's a given, that's the main reason I play them. This is coming from a solo, frugal player's perspective. Saying that:
    • KPQ has exp and shoes, but the shoes are replaced later but they are surprisingly helpful early game.
    • LPQ has exp and glasses, which oddly aren't easily replaced, but take a helluva time getting. It's worth it but those last few runs make you wish the grind was like 5 runs less.
    • EPQ has exp and earrings, which for how expensive earring scrolls can be is understandable why people want em. I certainly found their value.
    • OPQ has exp and gloves, which for people who just don't have money is an easy draw, but gloves are so cheap now I feel. It's hard to justify the effort, I agree. But the pq is fun and though I doubt smuggling will ever be an approved thing, it's part of the charm seeing what I basically skipped by only doing stage 2 a few dozen times back in my prebb days. OnionCourage
    • LMPQ is probably the only one I don't find very fun. It's also the shortest and I honestly can't even remember if it has a boss. I don't think it gives anything other than exp.
    • MPQ has exp and a pendant. The exp was always good but the pendant makes it worth at least investing in while you level up. Otherwise you'll be waiting until after 120 to get a deputy badge or whenever your guild is willing to take you to get a MoN.
    • PPQ has exp and a nice hat. Honestly I'm impressed with how well the hat is for a free item. I'd have gotten one if I didn't practically get my zhelm for free for being a defacto HB mule.
    • CWKPQ is probably the one I ran the least, but I remember thinking it was way out of my league lol. I think if it's exp ratio is horrible they might want to bump it up, but if it's good for the first twenty levels then I don't think it should be touched. MoNs are valuable per person, and the bonus stage has some good drops, right? I think maybe the drop table could include some ninja clan gear if that's not already in the works. I'd suggest Lionheart gear but that might be pulling too much from the future.

    Addendum:

    So what if CWKPQ significantly(within a comparable amount of time) gave you badges and hearts towards the turn-in rewards? That might be a consistent draw.

    Try your luck with bombing full maps for a couple hours, or take a slower, yet more consistent path to getting that turn-in to bait you once again into getting a mesogears ring lol

    I do think the MoN is the main gear draw towards that, but since a lot of people opt for an HT pendant instead, would a replacement set of goggles work? Something cool looking so we can look badass while fighting foes OnionNinja
    Or just put NX over it like we do with everything lol
     
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  5. Annolis
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    Annolis Skelegon

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    We both appear to be in the "Fun is Priority" camp. I'm not sure we are in the majority, unfortunately. BTW, my 12 chars had their Deputy Badges anywhere between level 80-82. There are a lot of friendly players willing to give you the Toe/Head drops when you scout them a BF or HH. =o)
     
  6. Estrahl
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    Estrahl Mr. Anchor

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    Yeah, I mean it's hard not to get super technical and fall into the habit of treating things as a chore in the [indeterminate amount of time] run, so that you can enjoy the potential future.

    I think that's why half of the "prospective end gamer" players end up quitting, they look at guides and think they'll have fun if they just hang in there.

    Of course I'm a degenerate who actually likes FFXIV ARR and will read through every line of dialogue and listen to the bad acting with a stupid smile on my face, enjoying every minute of it.
    For those who don't know, XIV's base game is notoriously boring for a lot of new players, and a lot of people tell them to stick through it because the next expansion is super good

    Oh, and bah! I knew I should have booped the couple I saw fighting him the other night. Maybe my guild might be willing to give me a freebie SlimeSweat2
     
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  7. xDarkomantis
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    xDarkomantis Mushmom

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    Reducing class signs to 1 is a no-brainer. It helps newer players, non-hardcore veteran players, and low-end Guilds be able to host Cwkpq. There's nothing enjoyable or special about asking/begging other players for signs. And it's certainly not enjoyable making and/or bringing mules to sign (or run inside) just to start a run. Before the other big server decided to reduce to 1 sign only per class, depending on if I was running Hero or NL I had:

    • 2 Warrior signs
    • 3 Archer signs (2 can solo room)
    • 2 Mage signs (Bishop for Rez and a Priest for HS)
    • 2 Pirate signs (one of them for SI)
    • 2 Thief signs
    Not having to mule to sign anymore is just a breath of fresh air.

    If a person is really struggling to know whether or not reducing class signs to 1 is negative, then just ask players from the other server on their experience on reddit.
     
    • Agree Agree x 10
  8. Crash
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    Crash Red Snail

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    Bumping this. I agree with everything from the post above me. Just want to add that HT got a prequest revamp because it was an unnecessary chore to do before each run. The same logic should be applied to CWK. Have it so everyone needs to do the CWK prequest in order to even sign up. Then reduce the signs to 1 per job.
     
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  9. HotCow
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    HotCow Pink Teddy

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    I'd like to see this aswell. It would make the CWK more accessible, right now when I run CWK I always bring 2/3 characters just for signs.
    If the suggestion goes through that you need to have done the prequest before you can sign up the only downside is for the people that run this with a low amount of people. (3 ,4, 5 man cwk). They'd have to do the prequest on all their mules. I don't really see an issue in that, though.
     
    • Like Like x 3
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Great Work Great Work x 1
  10. ryanlights
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    ryanlights Windraider

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    bump for more accessible CWKPQ
     
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  11. flow
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    flow Slimy

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    bumping because theres absolutely 0 reasons to keep things like that, the true partyquest buffs we need
     
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    • Agree Agree x 2
  12. marki
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    marki Red Snail

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    +1
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  13. Huiae
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    Huiae Headless Horseman

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    +1 with all my :heartbeat:
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  14. bienfu
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    bienfu Pac Pinky

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    Patiently waiting...

    How come this hasn't been approved?

    I hate being locked out of CWKPQ because the few runs that are owned by those who have mules are few. Would be able to run this content so much more if only base 5 signs are needed.

    There's no way in hell new guilds ever have any hopes of running cwkpq with 12 required signs
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  15. LeonardoJF
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    LeonardoJF Zakum

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    Exact! It happen with all boss, just need to get more and more sign mule, everyboss should need 3 sign (zak, ht), rav only 1 and cwk one job each
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  16. -ovv
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    -ovv Horntail

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    Lol, I guess we're here now.
     
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  17. xDarkomantis
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    xDarkomantis Mushmom

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    There can be a variety of reasons as to why it isn't approved.
    I recall on the other big server, it took 2 years of a person petitioning to make Warrior shields have 10 slots instead of being inferior to a lv20 Maple Shield. A lot of the Staff at the time never did Horntail before on their main accounts and I'm pretty sure never even did a Zakum run except like two Admins. One intern that had around six lv200s & 200b+ gear was ignored by the other Staff members on balance discussions. I wouldn't be surprised if Legends Staff kind of newby in the same way on that aspect.
    Their Dev may not have enough time to handle those changes yet, prioritizing Autoban or other aspects of the game. Or they're not interested but still keep the thread floating around. Who knows.
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  18. xDarkomantis
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    xDarkomantis Mushmom

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    I don't think there's anything wrong with the suggestion of not needing a full party to start an expedition. It's actually a bit silly that Legends has it this way. I see people pulling out a bunch of mules just to sign to do an expedition... Also, HTPQ requires a full 6man party when you only need ~2 people and ~3mins to get to room for Life Roots. HTPQ sellers making good money though lol
     
  19. Lin
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    Lin Headless Horseman

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    I get ditched off CWKPQ when folks find out i can only bring one character in, REDUUUUUCE IT!!!!
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Useful Useful x 1
  20. Soblet
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    Soblet Zakum

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    Pretty sure you can sign multiple characters from the same account, just need to relog.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1

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