Let's talk about channels

REDUCTION
I am always for doing things that help bring the community closer together. I don't see a reason for 9 channels at this stage in LEGENDS, so I agree to a reduction. Five feels healthy to me. As many of my guildmates will say, a LOT of them I have met just wondering about in places my character shouldn't be and going "Hey! Need help leveling? Want to Party?" and going from there. Having that chance in a more bunched up community would be awesome!

GS2 CLONE/MINI DUNGEON
A mini-dungeon to me defeats the purpose to the channel reduction. Giving people their own personal space to train just seems like you are bunching the community together to have them hide away in little spots. I am rather torn though with the mixed opinions of the community. I like the idea of GS3 and 4 being used for something, but unsure if a GS2 clone is the way to go. I see the importance of the idea because, yes, it is one of the most popular places. With the meta of the server being as it is which is heavily leeched focus, if a player doesn't have a Cleric or an HSMule, they will be making one at some point in their LEGENDS career if they stick with it long enough. Just the nature of the beast. So having multiple GS2's kind of helps that meta get pushed forward a bit. While at the same time I like the idea of more unique mobs here potentially. I think looking into less desirable training locations of the same level range is not a bad idea. Looking through every guide on LEGENDS and you see the same maps listed for training on all of them. Lets try to mix that up a bit.

BOSSING
I can tell from my alliance personally that boss timers are kept pretty well when farming Manon and all that. I don't think a reduction of channels is going to change this outcome at all. Getting a Manon or whatever area boss will still be as challenging as it is now. Just the nature of the beast. Especially when some classes get their biggest grinding benefit from things like Headless or BF. And I don't think boss timer reduction is the solution here. I feel looking into less desirable training locations might be the answer for this also as well as doing the alternate HTPQ quest for the rock skip. I honestly don't think that was a bad idea. I don't feel HT is "easy" and the reason we see more people doing it. I just think we have more people that can do it, and the great HT SECRET ATTACK PLAN was going to be figured out eventually that people could down it as easy as John's first jumping quest for his wife.

TL;DR:
Less Channels
Less desirable maps made more desirable
Maybe unique mobs instead of GS2 clone
No minidungeon
No reduced boss timers
HT rock skip go.

 

Basically, with 9 channel, there are 9 GS2. So to keep the number of GS2 maps to 9, just add a dungeon in GS3 with the same layout of GS2. (Not sure if this possible).

So with only 4 channels, we still have 8 GS2 maps technically.

That the easiest way out.

Anyway, it is just that handful of maps that people sell leech that will be full.

Leech is cancer. Cancer spreads. You cant stop cancer.

 

You can't see them once you pick one up tho, especially if you cc.

 

Yeah, but I'm pretty sure you can kill a Manon, don't pick up the item, cc, kill another Manon, pick up Cry, cc back and pick up the first one (easier done if second Manon is low already). I know you can do it easily on Cornians to get multiple Marrows (after a Marrow drop, keep killing for like 2 minutes to see if you can get more before the first one expires).
Anyway, the reason I mentioned turning it into a One-of-a-kind item is so that you can't stack them if a Manon could drop multiple Cries.

 

If there's a reduction in channels something nice would be to make other places more competitive with buffs to classic maps, rather than increase the number of meta maps so everyone can still have one. Like increasing the spawn rate/exp of Death Teddies to make it an alternative to gs2, and for later levels have a similar increase to the Aqua Road gorge with Sharks/Squids/Bone Fish and to the rest of underground Ludi being buffed to make it a competitive place to grind. Currently the underground for Ludi is only used for Pap and Spirit Viking safespotting, but almost everything else could be buffed to create more viable training spots to keep the game interesting.

Currently the meta is to just camp single maps for an absurd amount of levels(GS2, Mannequins, Gallos, maybe WR a little) or to just leech your way to 120+, which doesn't create a very fun experience, it's just about doing things as efficiently as possible or else go to somewhere painfully slow if you feel like having an adventure. For a well-balanced game we should reward adventure, especially to the really old, nostalgic maps, and keep places like gs2 or himes at a low number of maps.

Would it be possible to make Manon instanced to be like Zakum, and you can fight it twice a day? That would help some of the fighting over timers, but then again I can see how it could make things more EZ-Story.

 

You can't look second cry. When you cc and go back it's gone. We've tested this

 

The issue I see. If we want to buff maps. I feel like ppl won't train there , because people just leech away to 120 regardless. More low lvl leeching packages are seen more often then never done before. Leech exp should be decreased it's not worth doing. (I'll leech and I still think it should be nerfed). Less leeching = more grinding. And puts people more interactive. I've seen alot of ppl quit because people don't grind anymore.

Overall I like all your reasons except the instant manon.

 

Thats same map, once you leave the map or cc you cant see it.

 

To make a deal both ways you could reduce the channels (to 5 for example) and if needed then the popular leeching maps can have mini dungeons which are the exact clones of the maps, so with same mobs and amount of mobs etc. That way you are reducing the channels, bringing people more together, and at the same time not taking away the opportunities in popular leeching places like it is right now.

 

you arent bringing people togerther, if you make a mini dungeon that ppl can just enter/stay in and not talk to people.

Leech % from attacker to leecher should also be reduced lol. not trying for a "LeechLegends"

 

copy royals implementation where you only need a manon KILL rather than a cry. This way an entire party can coordinate and get all their prereqs done with a single manon

 

How about a quest line that allows you to summon a special Manon in a special map - which can be repeatable as necessary, but only drops the Manon Cry?

Slimy and Selkie Jr. mobs are very popular because of the rate of experience they give. If Mr. Anchor mobs were equivalent, that may make room for others. Nevertheless, if you reduce channels then having a dungeon is vital.

The other problem I see is the Free Market. People are setting up shops in FMs 1-4 up through to channel 7. Yes, they could consolidate in the other rooms that aren't used in channels 2-4, but this may cause some backlash with some players. This could be alleviated if Owls of Minerva could be bought with mesos or have no expiration date if bought in the Cash Shop.

In the end, I agree with your observations and your strategy. You need to reduce the channels.

 

If we're only given 5 channels to get the cry from Manon, according to my calculations, that would mean that there's only +-30 cries to go around per day.
The numbers may seem insignificant but I feel it would encourage people to be parking their characters in caves more often and result in less interactions with other players.
Which kind of defeats the purpose of reducing the number of channels at the first place.
We're talking about almost halving the number of bosses available so it is gonna be pretty significant.
After all, you cant force people to socialize simply by reducing the number of channels. There should be another way of getting people to mingle rather than reducing the number of channels.

 

Manon is a very valid concern with the amount of people running HT these days, glad someone brought it up. If you reduce the amount of channels the spawn time of manon has to be reduced by half or more to prevent people or entire guilds of claiming the manon maps for a big portion of the day by camping it, which would be frustrating to the max.

I really hope that it's dealt with before we reduce the amount of channels.

 

I personally don't see the point of changing Manon or HT prequests because if we do change Manon then other bosses should be changes, some bosses are killed to complete some quests (Griffey much like Manon is also needed for Job adv/Hero's Will/drops) and other bosses that drop chairs/scrolls or farmed for their exp will be affected by this change as much as Manon.

 

I don't think its fair to compare manon to any other boss if there are no changes to the HT prequest. Especially during high traffic hours, if there were only 5 channels of manon they would all be camped by people. So let's say you find an empty channel. It's very likely manon was just killed, which means you have to camp a map without doing anything for 4 hours unless you get really lucky. After that you still have to collect all the other items needed to enter HT.

Our runs usually take 1 hour. This means that doing the HT prequest itself would be 4 to 5 times longer then doing the boss itself (HT should be buffed IMO, but that's a discussion for another day).

I'm not sure about everyone else, but spending that much time doing only a prequest to enter HT or be locked in the cave for multiple days, begging people to bring along pots with them so you don't have to leave and go to the alternative hell that is called Manon's forest again seems very, very obnoxious.

 

Proposing my 2nd solution:

Keep the current GS2 maps without adding new dungeon.

Fix the HP/EXp ratio of mobs. In this case, fix those that are within the range the lvl range of Slimey.

This will encourage people to grind other mobs.

PS: Neckson really Screw maplestory when they refuse to balance HP/EXP mobs correctly. Some mobs just so much better to grind than other in terms of HP/EXP ratio.

Using Horntail as a case defend to the removal of channels in my opinion is a very weak case. A handful of players ( in this case, high lvl players that farm or sell Horntail services) seeking the luxury of easy farming with more channels.

If people had defend the changes like lack of channel for PQ or PQ is always full, it would have been a much stronger case.

It is time for the people (or in this case, players) to get out of their comfort zone.

Look at the Big picture, it is obvious with the current population, 9 channels are too much.

 

How is it not fair when it was like that, and why should the accessibility to an end game boss be made easier too? Staying in the cave is really an option you can avoid, unless you can't be bothered hunting all the items again and waiting for a manon. Having 6 channels where manon can spawn 6 times a day in each channel (36 total manons a day) is enough for all HT runners right now, its not like all 100 players who do HT will prepare during the same day.

 

I want to add my two cents on this, from a perspective I have not seen yet.
I'm fine with reducing channels to improve social conditions, and I dont really mind less trainspots as I'm generally not in the most populated ones anyway.

I do, however, like to bosshunt and most of my Guildies do as well. Not zakum or something, but the minibosses like Mushmom, Faust etc. We hunt for chairs, the untradeable ones. Even with 9 channels and perfect timings, this is a grind. We really spend a lot of time in it, and it can take weeks before a chair drops. With less channels, there's less bosses. This'll make it even harder and less rewarding.

would you consider upping the droprate, or spawn rate of these bosses?