1. Hello!

    First of all, welcome to MapleLegends! You are currently viewing the forums as a guest, so you can only view the first post of every topic. We highly recommend registering so you can be part of our community.

    By registering to our forums you can introduce yourself and make your first friends, talk in the shoutbox, contribute, and much more!

    This process only takes a few minutes and you can always decide to lurk even after!

    - MapleLegends Administration-
  2. Experiencing disconnecting after inserting your login info? Make sure you are on the latest MapleLegends version. The current latest version is found by clicking here.
    Dismiss Notice

Perma beginner, skill?!

Discussion in 'Rejected' started by Junaki, Mar 4, 2021.

Passive skill unlocked

  1. Interesting - let's explore this thought

    33.3%
  2. Good idea

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  3. Bad idea

    66.7%
  1. Junaki
    Offline

    Junaki Stone Golem

    119
    34
    140
    Apr 1, 2015
    Male
    Northern New York
    2:37 AM
    Google, Piks, Arkin, JunakiG, Doss, Nezi
    Hero, Paladin, Dark Knight, I/L Arch Mage, Bishop, Bowmaster, Marksman, Night Lord, Shadower, Buccaneer, Corsair
    Galaxy
    Hi, just something that I've been thinking about and wanted to share with you guys and your opinion on it.
    Nope this is only mentioned because it literally is the hardest class in the server to level and play.
    Maybe it wouldn't be a bad idea to give beginners a passive skill when they tex reach a certain milestone.
    Milestones : same as job advancements for other class. I.e. ,30,70,120.

    So the passive skill I'm thinking about is related to being a merchant.

    So instead of focusing their skills in swordsmanship(warriors), magic(mages), archery(archers), etc (sorry on my phone and at work so a little too lazy to continue but I'm sure you guys understand what I mean).
    Perma beginners decided to raise their skills in trades. They speak the language of money.
    What I mean by this is reach milestone achieved by a beginner they would obtain a passive skill that would increase by a % a discount at npcs.
    So say:
    Level 30: 5% discounted items at npc.
    Level 70: 10% discounted items at npc.
    Level 120: 15% discounted items at npc.
    Level 200: 30% discounted items at npc.
    This is only for npcs, not player stores, obviously..
    Could go as far as saying they can also npc items for the same increase in % , 30:5%, 70:10%, etc.

    Now I don't have a perma beginner so this is not fit me to take advantage at all. I just figured it might give these perma beginners which are actually quite a few... Something to enjoy for their hardwork in achieving such milestones.
    I'm interested in conversing with you guys and finding out your thoughts in this?

    As always no matter what happens you will always have prolly who will abuse anything to get them gains ( people making perma beginners and leeching them to unlock milestones) but we can't let that stop maple legends from evolving more.
    Like Kimmy said before, we're not really stressing gms like forever, eventually ML becomes their own identity and becomes less gms like as things develop.
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 10
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  2. Nightz
    Online

    Nightz Supervisor Staff Member Supervisor Game Moderator

    1,892
    1,068
    490
    Oct 22, 2020
    Male
    8:37 AM
    Nightz
    I/L Arch Mage
    200
    Funk & Pasta
    Moderator Post
    Although I like the incentive of this and the general idea. I am already fairly sure this will just make it meta to create one permabeginner and leech it to at least 120. having a 15% cost reduction on NLC pots for example is quite big
     
    • Agree Agree x 11
    • Useful Useful x 2
  3. OP
    OP
    Junaki
    Offline

    Junaki Stone Golem

    119
    34
    140
    Apr 1, 2015
    Male
    Northern New York
    2:37 AM
    Google, Piks, Arkin, JunakiG, Doss, Nezi
    Hero, Paladin, Dark Knight, I/L Arch Mage, Bishop, Bowmaster, Marksman, Night Lord, Shadower, Buccaneer, Corsair
    Galaxy
    Or they could just make it instead of discounted price it could just be an increase in npcing things.
    Even at 120, npcing with an extra 15% is really not that much for the work that needs to be put in. 115k instead of 100k.
     
  4. Soblet
    Offline

    Soblet Zakum

    1,415
    1,355
    491
    Sep 14, 2015
    8:37 AM
    Soblet
    Bandit
    200
    Pasta
    Did you present this to the beginner council first?
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Useful Useful x 1
    • Creative Creative x 1
  5. OP
    OP
    Junaki
    Offline

    Junaki Stone Golem

    119
    34
    140
    Apr 1, 2015
    Male
    Northern New York
    2:37 AM
    Google, Piks, Arkin, JunakiG, Doss, Nezi
    Hero, Paladin, Dark Knight, I/L Arch Mage, Bishop, Bowmaster, Marksman, Night Lord, Shadower, Buccaneer, Corsair
    Galaxy
    I did not.
     
  6. Finally
    Offline

    Finally Mano

    14
    28
    15
    Feb 20, 2021
    Male
    3:37 AM
    Papylon
    Shadower
    134
    We could give the treatment that Ragnarok Online gave to their Novice class creating a new job (SuperNovice) with access to all 1st job's skills (maybe cap all skills at lvl 10 in ML). Im not saying that this is the best path actually, but i'm trying to say that i would prefer a custom content to go allout, like new questlines, etc. 15% discount seems to much really, and would impact the game too much, wouldnt it? How about a % increase in damage, hp/mp while begginers are in fullparty of them without the presence of the other of the 5 classes?. This would not make them "meta", but could delivery more confort and fun to the begginers' community, i'd imagine.
     
    • Creative Creative x 1
  7. OP
    OP
    Junaki
    Offline

    Junaki Stone Golem

    119
    34
    140
    Apr 1, 2015
    Male
    Northern New York
    2:37 AM
    Google, Piks, Arkin, JunakiG, Doss, Nezi
    Hero, Paladin, Dark Knight, I/L Arch Mage, Bishop, Bowmaster, Marksman, Night Lord, Shadower, Buccaneer, Corsair
    Galaxy
    It also doesn't have to be 15% these are just numbers I generated as an "idea". It can be 2,4,6%
    Everyone is stuck with the number instead of the concept of it. Numbers can be adjusted so it wouldn't be "way too much"
     
  8. Chris
    Offline

    Chris Zakum Retired Staff

    1,746
    6,689
    521
    Jan 18, 2016
    Maple Island
    2:37 AM
    Christopher
    Islander
    Southperry
    Is this suppose to be a buff for perma beginners or a buff to mages?

    Beginners already don’t have to use mp & their hp is so low that buying pots isn’t an issue.

    Mages are the class of money, I only see this suggestion useful towards people using a beginner as a mule rather than to the people actually playing perma beginners as a class.
     
    • Agree Agree x 8
    • Like Like x 1
  9. Isme
    Offline

    Isme Brown Teddy

    65
    258
    75
    Dec 21, 2020
    3:37 AM
    1sme
    Islander
    I'd say that most perma beginners doesn't care about custom content being implemented for them to improve their playing experience. The main reason behind choosing this class is because it's equally challenging and rewarding. Note that in other servers, beginners have access to Maroon Mop and Sake Bottle, which are powerfull beginners-only weapons, and, as we always discuss, I would vote against their implementation in MapleLegends. Weapon diversity is also a fun aspect of playing perma beginner. Although it's good to discuss these ideas, personally, I prefer things as they currently are, but let's hear the others.
     
    • Agree Agree x 7
    • Informative Informative x 1
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  10. -ovv
    Online

    -ovv Horntail

    2,353
    946
    500
    Feb 23, 2020
    Male
    11:37 PM
    -ovv
    Beginner
    200
    Honor
    This would actually just eclipse the accomplishments of existing permabeginners altogether as it would incentivize other people to create beginner mules which can be easily leeched. People already self-leech their int-attackers (which are basically permabeginners that job adv'd) to 155. If you gave a transferrable benefit to permabeginners, it will for sure be abused and muled out.

    I voted that this idea is interesting, but I don't think it's polished enough. It'd be cool to see updates that give permabeginners a more substantial 'identity' though.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. deer
    Offline

    deer Pac Pinky

    195
    398
    191
    Oct 27, 2020
    Female
    Oddville
    6:37 AM
    cervid
    Bishop
    130
    Oddjobs
    I disagree with the idea as stated, but if you wanted to persevere with the general idea, here's something that might make more sense:

    Allow permabeginners to optionally take """third job advancement""" at level 70+. All this does is grant them a single skill (or maybe up to two skills, whatever) of their choosing. The skill would be selected from a pool of skills that might look like:
    • Keen Eyes (my only permabeginner on MapleLegends is a besinner, and I would absolutely love having just this skill)
    • Power Stance
    • Power Guard
    • Guardian
    • Element Resistance
    • Monster Magnet
    • Aura of the Beholder
    • Bullet Time/Nimble Body
    • Thrust
    • Puppet
    • Wings
    • Alchemist
    Note that while all of these are normal skills used by ordinary jobs, none of them really violate the core identity of permabeginners (and I might note that Aura of the Beholder is basically a fourth-job version of Recovery, which is a beginner skill).

    I'm not seriously proposing this for MapleLegends (if I were, I'd make a separate thread), but maybe it will help give some food for thought.
     
    • Creative Creative x 3
  12. -ovv
    Online

    -ovv Horntail

    2,353
    946
    500
    Feb 23, 2020
    Male
    11:37 PM
    -ovv
    Beginner
    200
    Honor
    Actually, I take back what I said. If this 'advancement' could only be done on the Island, all the aforementioned complications could be avoided.
     
  13. Chris
    Offline

    Chris Zakum Retired Staff

    1,746
    6,689
    521
    Jan 18, 2016
    Maple Island
    2:37 AM
    Christopher
    Islander
    Southperry
    I don't believe adding/giving any skills to beginners is the direction to go if one would want to buff perma beginners. The core identity of playing a perma beginner is that you are jobless without skills. You know what you are getting into when creating one.

    One of the issues I find personally when thinking about playing a perma beginner is the hard cap you face when you start get into the 100s. Exp starts to get slow, mobs start to hit too much, & your damage isn't enough to kill the higher mobs efficiently.

    Beginners have one of the highest def formulas in the game, if not the highest in the game. They suffer drastically from their low hp IMO and it becomes difficult to wash a significant amount due to the shitty formulas, & the levels you would be washing are the prime levels of playing a perma beginner. A drastic buff to that formula would sure make it easier for beginners to participate in more content/the current content. Although some might actually like this aspect and view it as a challenge so who knows if perma beginners would even want this change.

    Additionally beginners tend to use polearms as their main weapons. I would think a nice buff to the class/community would be throwing 30% polearm scrolls into the drop table of end game beginner maps. Unfortunately I think the end game maps are in ghost ship, and since those maps def don't need any buffs my suggestion would be to add them into FoG's drop table, which I believe is an alternative to ghost ship for beginners. Spear for 30% already exists at wolfspiders (a popular leeching map) so I don't believe this should have any drastic impact on the game as polearms are usually viewed as inferior to spears for the DrK class.

    Then finally ofc just making the Crimson Arcglaive & purple surfboard more accessible.


    #IslanderIsTheBestBeginnerClass #StorageOnMapleIsland
     
    • Like Like x 6
  14. deer
    Offline

    deer Pac Pinky

    195
    398
    191
    Oct 27, 2020
    Female
    Oddville
    6:37 AM
    cervid
    Bishop
    130
    Oddjobs
    Except that beginners have access to at least three skills; or more, depending on how you count.
     
  15. Chris
    Offline

    Chris Zakum Retired Staff

    1,746
    6,689
    521
    Jan 18, 2016
    Maple Island
    2:37 AM
    Christopher
    Islander
    Southperry
    Ahh yes how could I forget three snails, recovery, & nimble feet. How would any perma beginner survive without them? OnionMuha
     
    • Like Like x 5
  16. deer
    Offline

    deer Pac Pinky

    195
    398
    191
    Oct 27, 2020
    Female
    Oddville
    6:37 AM
    cervid
    Bishop
    130
    Oddjobs
    You could be equally derisive towards half of the 1st+ job skills out there, but I see no reason to be so needlessly cynical and sarcastic (to say nothing of other skills that beginners have access to, like downjump, legendary spirit, etc.). One of the quaint things about MapleStory is that beyond skills that have obviously extreme utility (e.g. Holy Symbol) and those that contribute directly to doing lots of damage (Lucky Seven, Genesis), most skills add flavour and small, but significant, differences in playstyle. I personally think that permabeginners are basically fine as-is (other than the points you rightfully brought up about them having way too low HP gain), but I wouldn't just, out of hand, dismiss any attempt to give permabeginners the option to have some differences in flavour here or there. Basic-attacking will always be the only DPS "skill" of beginners, and beginners will never have a powerful utility skill like Holy Symbol, and that's fine.
     
    • Like Like x 4
  17. Chris
    Offline

    Chris Zakum Retired Staff

    1,746
    6,689
    521
    Jan 18, 2016
    Maple Island
    2:37 AM
    Christopher
    Islander
    Southperry
    I referred to their identity (specifically perma beginners not beginners in general) as being without skills. Not that they literally had no skills. Those skills have use from levels 1-8/10, the same way 1st job skills utilize 10-30.
     
    • Like Like x 3
    • Agree Agree x 1
  18. RegalStar
    Offline

    RegalStar Nightshadow

    647
    245
    345
    Sep 23, 2019
    Male
    2:37 AM
    DMsRebirth
    Even ignoring the question of whether this kind of thing is a good idea or not, the amount of technical work these ideas involve is absurd and there's absolutely NO way that any of it is going to happen realistically.
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 2
  19. Daydreamer
    Offline

    Daydreamer Headless Horseman

    722
    243
    376
    Jul 8, 2017
    Male
    11:37 PM
    I/L Arch Mage
    I'd love this but personally I don't think this is the right server for a change this big and developer-intensive. We don't even have maroon mop lol.
     
    • Agree Agree x 5
  20. zeroxlr
    Offline

    zeroxlr Windraider

    437
    503
    296
    Oct 11, 2020
    11:37 PM
    xxxxSnuggles
    Beginner, Camper, Islander
    Perma beginners on this server do well on their own, with the mechanics of what maplestory was, and what maplelegends is.

    Being that this is a type of nostalgia server, there isn't anything to change or add except beginner weapons. Although those weapons like the maroon mop and sake bottle have been suggested over the years, they don't fit in to the current maplelegends meta of being a perma beginner.

    Since there already are the Crimson Arcglaive, and the Purple Surfboard! Also, the best DPS is actually not those weapons either haha (hint, it's a dagger).

    Currently, perma beginners on maplelegends are able to do AFK zakum runs and get the z-helm.

    Also, there's enough weapons + scrolls and HP-equips (monster/event rings) to be able to do boss runs. OnionPerfect

    Discounted NPC prices doesn't mean anything. Perma beginners commonly use Att Buffs from cheap ciders, heartstoppers, and or onyx apples. Also have enough potions on Auto-HP Potion 3xPets(equipped with HP), after face-tanking at least 1hit from bosses.

    Going to the NPC shops are for NPC-ing bad items. By selling stuff in FM, there's easily enough money to buy top tier items. :sack:

    There's enough mesos, gear drops, and gachas from mobs to be able to amass +50m mesos as just a perma beginner. Or just make a bishop meso-making mule like everyone else.

    The best ease-of-use would not only be helpful for perma beginners, but everyone; an item for more HP.

    As the whole server knows, HP is always a factor ...but this affects the meta of Washing (a very touchy subject). sweatmush
     
    • Like Like x 4
    • Informative Informative x 1

Share This Page