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Revert Changes to Strafe. And Buff?

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by RainbowYarn, Aug 22, 2020.

  1. RainbowYarn
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    RainbowYarn Pink Teddy

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    6:45 AM
    Good day, good day, a newly advanced Sniper here! And omg I have finally gotten my hands on the 5 hit strafe!

    Anyway, on to the thread. I'm not exactly good at giving good points for my ideas, so I'll just get them across nice and simple.

    I have been thinking that the changes made to Sniper's Strafe with the last skill balances is a bit too much, and should be reverted to its original state, and then given a small buff. I have read some stuff and have thought of some things, so I will make simple points make my argument.

    -

    1. At max level, Strafe only does 75% damage. Now, while it does a good 5 hits, the % damage itself still seems too low, at least in 4th job. Strafe is our main attack, and it can't even deal 100% damage. The main point here is that with such a low % output, it can be more difficult for Snipers to deal enough damage to knockback a monster. I don't know how important it is, really, but I can at least use Headless Horseman as an example, even though we have puppet and therefore it's not really an issue. But it may be important on certain monsters (I did read something about the Pirate Crimsonwood Party Boss).

    2. Main point. As we are aiming to be a pre big bang experience, I don't think it's suitable at all to make changes that are too far out there, or too big. One example being Assassin's Critical Throw skill, in which the chance to hit for critical damage was halved, while its damage output was greatly increased, causing assassin's to have low critical chance, but massive damage when they do, which seems strange and out of place as they would normally have stable damage. Anyway, Strafe was never able to hit 5 times in any version of Maple, though there was Ultimate Strafe in 4th job which hit 6 times. It was always meant to hit 4 times. But changing it to 5 is just too much of a difference, and such things should not be a part of any server that's trying to recreate the pre big bang experience. It isn't right to make such big changes, and Legends should not do things like this. Basically it's like breaking the rules.

    3. From what I've seen on other threads about recent changes, I know this change was implemented to make the gap between Marksman and Bowmaster smaller, so that they have similar bossing ability, or something like that. One thread/post did give details about damage output, and apparently, non critical attacks from 5-hit Strafe has lower damage than 4-hit Strafe, the only time when damage was increased is with critical hits (with Sharp Eyes active I think) in which the damage output was a fair bit higher (nice).

    Point here is that the whole change was made to make Sniper's damage output with Strafe better, or more in line with Hurricane. But instead of giving a simple small damage boost to Strafe, the staff decided to completed change the skill by decreasing its damage a fair bit and adding a 5th hit. But none of that is needed. Like at all. Therefore my suggestion is to just increase Strafe's damage output while keeping the number of hits the same, thus keeping the skill what it should be while also giving them the higher damage output that was intended.

    I mean, there's no logical reason why you should decrease its damage and increase the number of hits and mess with the skill instead of just giving a small damage boost. That's all you have to do. Like seriously. That's it. Perhaps the change was made to give them greater damage with critical hits, thus the added line of damage, but can't this be implemented without giving another line of damage? Can't you just give a small damage boost instead?

    -

    Anyway, I'm not sure if I've done a good job here or not, but I'll simplify everything.

    1. Lower % damage spread over more lines = less chance of knockback
    2. Changes skills too much = not the original pre big bang experience
    3. Give Strafe a small damage boost to make it more in line with Bowmaster damage

    Final conclusion.

    Revert the changes made to Strafe back to the original changes of 4 hits with 110% damage.
    Then, give it a small damage boost, like 115% damage output, or 120% or whatever.
    Keep the skill the way it should be. 4 Hits is good. 5 Hits is bad.

    -
    Did I do okay?
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 4
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • Great Work Great Work x 1
  2. ngrman
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    ngrman Stone Golem

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    Jun 4, 2017
    1:45 AM
    Don't forget the fact that current strafe is worse for 3rd job now.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  3. OP
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    RainbowYarn
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    RainbowYarn Pink Teddy

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    That, too. Thank you for commenting.

    Also. People like my post and said good job and gave me that medal thing.
    IM SO HAPPY.
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  4. xadra
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    xadra Capt. Latanica

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    I don't understand why you take so much issue with strafe having more hits than original Maple, especially when there are so many other equally big changes to other skills in the game already.
     
  5. OP
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    RainbowYarn
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    RainbowYarn Pink Teddy

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    I said why in my post. Messing with skills too much.
    Do you have reasons why you disagree? Didn't state any.
     
  6. xadra
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    xadra Capt. Latanica

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    There are other change in maplelegends which have already been changed equally, and I don't get why you dislike this one so particularly much. For example, assassinate also got an additional hit. Rage has 10 additional levels. Buccaneer skills have been largely buffed across the board. Threaten defence reduction is multiplied by 5. Heavens Hammer's damage (the damage cap) is doubled, and the cooldown is decreased.

    So why is the strafe buff "messing with skills too much"?
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  7. Ben Ten
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    Ben Ten Slime

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    You're a newly advanced Sniper w/o maxed Strafe. Give it some time and actually max it out and play your class before judging the potential of your damage.

    Even if you struggle with Headless Horseman, you'll always have other alternative to grind i.e. CD's, Vikings, Newts (if you're masochistic) and maybe Himes if you went Arrow Eruption first.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Informative Informative x 1
  8. yurain
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    yurain Windraider

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    2:45 PM
    YUrain
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    Hm. The strafe change is made to cater for the damage increase of a marksman at the later level with SE/SI and whatever buff is there. This does give up on some damage during 3rd job. However I believe most Sniper/Marksman are willing to give up some 3rd job damage for better 4th job damage. Also just feel like saying it, Snipe should go through weapon cancel.

    I also think that most Sniper should be grinding with Arrow Eruption more than strafe?

    Anyway. I do think that the last patch has too much of a heavy focus on the post lv140 content without considering too much for those before that. Just see how the crit change happened, and have to be reverted (when?)
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  9. RegalStar
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    RegalStar Nightshadow

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    1) Even without SE, post-buff Strafe still averages 625% damage vs. pre-buff Strafe's 640%. I can tell you right off the bat that the difference here is effectively meaningless; you're going to train with eruption for the most part so the 2.4% difference means basically nothing in grinding. It's only going to come into play when you kill headless horseman basically, and the 10 or so seconds worth of difference it's going to make is unnoticeable.

    2) With almost any boss in the game, the reduced knockback is meaningless. Usually the boss is either too easy to kncokback anyways (eg BF/Samurai), too hard to knockback (with Strafe) anyways (eg Nameless/Scar), can't be knockback in the first place (eg HT/Zak), or KB makes no difference (eg pirate boss in CWK, where things are actually easier when you can't kb it the side platforms are a much better place to be than the center). The only boss where knockback actually makes a difference is Papulatus, but Snipe knockback works just fine for the most part and you'll have maxed snipe long before you reach enough damage to knockback with Strafe either way unless you have insane gears.

    3) ML already has a LOT of custom contents not just with skills, but also areas that were exclusive to other regions, areas that weren't implemented in v62 to begin with, custom commands, custom items, and crapload of other custom features. If you want something that's closer to how GMS was then ML isn't for you to begin with.

    4) For 4-hit Strafe to be boosted to the same level as the 5-hit strafe we have now, it'd have to be increased to 132.75% per shot, not something like 115% or 120%. As far as pure 3rd job comparison go Sniper is actually a lot better than Ranger already even with the slightly weaker numbers on Strafe (they have the same attack speed without SI, and crossbows give higher damage range than bows); there's no need to buff them even further.
     
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  10. Nise
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    Nise Supervisor Staff Member Supervisor Game Moderator

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    3:45 PM
    NoraONE
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    I think Regal summarized everything really well here. The other thing I would add about a stronger 4 hit strafe, is that it faces the same issue as OG strafe, which is that it wouldn't scale that great with end-game. It wouldn't get the damage increase you'd get with SI, nor the scalability with having an extra line.
     

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