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HP Challenge Analysis

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by akashsky, Jul 14, 2024.

  1. akashsky
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    akashsky Horntail

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    The challenge system was announced in october of 2022, and the full HP value is finally released as of 7/12/2024. A total of 642 days have passed since announcement to full release, during which a new character started at the announcement would have been able to amass 4.1 million nx.

    This would have been enough nx to wash nearly any range DPS to ~17k hp (finished), and would have been enough to have 30k potential range characters washed to around 9k base HP.

    Overall, I'd say that any range character made after 6/8/2023 have 100% benefited from waiting for the HP challenge system to be released, whereas those made earlier could have benefited from doing a normal wash (with those made at announcement certainly having been better off washing normally).

    The below table roughly summarizes the NX value of the hp challenge system (NX required to reach the specified HP value with normal HP washing):
    upload_2024-7-13_22-22-2.png

    *Mage ranges depending on how early mp washing is started (starting later needs less nx)

    So, it seems that range classes get the best deal, followed by shadowers, and that buccaneers /warriors get the least value.

    Overall, I would say that the challenge system provides enough HP for most content, though I do want to list out the specific scenarios that I think it fails to provide enough hp.

    Warriors - Challenged warriors are close enough to 30k warriors for all scenarios.

    Mage (bishop) - 3400 HP (even if pushed close to 5.4k after rings) isn't sufficient for tanking hits while dispelled in a lot of bosses, notably bishop in horntail , though this is a niche scenario that can be avoided with good planning.

    Bucc - 17k isn't comfortable enough for AUF, where dispels happen frequently and its rare to find a DK on a run. With careful play its probably still doable, but I wouldn't want to attempt it. Its also not enough for pink bean unless you get hyper body, which is an issue on optimized 18man runs (where the only dk are usually hb mules in the corner).

    Range - 12k HP on a corsair at pink bean is fine if you have hyper body and running with a bird first strategy, but on an optimized bird last run its simply not viable (unless you have hb and a bishop to heal it). The pot burn at 12k hp is also incredibly high for corsairs (they have the lowest avoid of all range classes). Archers have similar issue at pb with this HP due to survivability, but at least fair better on potion usage due to higher avoid. NLs with 12k are completely fine for the most part as long as they have HB. All challenged range classes will have a rough time at auf, though I have seen people clear it with ~12k hp while playing extremely carefully.

    Shad - 10k hp with meso guard lets you do all content without hb, after you have gotten things like t10 ring / euphenia ring and possibly some scrolled pet equips for hp and some extra level up HP

    Overall, I would say the best challenge class is shadower - with regards to how much value in NX the challenge system gives you and its end game viability.
     

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    Last edited: Jul 14, 2024
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  2. TermiteLover
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    TermiteLover Timer

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    Surely anyone who committed to the game around the time of announcement of HP challenges employed the multi-vote meta. The biggest benefit I see from this is for new players who don't know they will stick around, and for "first characters" of older players who struggled in some of the end-game content
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  3. beegoratto
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    beegoratto Zakum

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    Out of curiosity, does this also factor in the amount of effort it would take to level a character that’s actively washing? I know it’s hard to quantify but for a new player, the difference between leveling an active, playable character vs a washing character is significant enough that I’d argue even past the NX breakpoint it’s worth to do challenges.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
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  4. Subterlabor
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    Subterlabor Zakum

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    I would think someone is capable of making a 120 bishop and leech an attacker to 135-145 to wash out in a nearly 2 year span. Even weekend warriors can very easily achieve that.
     
  5. Subterlabor
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    Subterlabor Zakum

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    I'll be testing this theory soon
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2024
  6. LeonardoJF
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    LeonardoJF Horntail

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    I believe that now with the item that HP gives, we will be able to have better feedback in theory, maybe if we had this from the beginning we could have had more feedback to think about
    possible rework, but now at least it will be possible to have this analysis in practice
     
  7. OP
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    akashsky
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    akashsky Horntail

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    No, it does not. Also, while your statement is true when leveling a character directly, there is a reason that our servers meta is mage first -> leech. Its simply faster than normal grinding.
     
  8. beegoratto
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    beegoratto Zakum

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    Agree, although I figured we're already assuming this is a first character attacker given the expected progress they would have needed to have made in the past year-ish for the NX breakpoint.
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 2

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