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warrior balanced change thread (all)

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by Magen, Jan 17, 2021.

vote if you like the suggestion

  1. DK suggestion +1

    14 vote(s)
    24.6%
  2. Paladin suggestion +1

    14 vote(s)
    24.6%
  3. Hero suggestion +1

    19 vote(s)
    33.3%
  4. Disagree with DK suggestion

    19 vote(s)
    33.3%
  5. Disagree with Paladin suggestion

    12 vote(s)
    21.1%
  6. Disagree with Hero Suggestion

    23 vote(s)
    40.4%
Multiple votes are allowed.
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  1. iPippy
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    iPippy Nightshadow

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    6:46 PM
    iPippy
    It really does suck that there are no heroes allowed in pb. Or are we talking about the enrage-less axe heroes? /s
     
  2. BananaPie
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    BananaPie Selkie Jr.

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    11:46 PM
    Okay for the third time since you don't get it. Nothing will change even if they buff enrage to deal more single target or whatever else you're suggesting to boost single target dmg. If I'm r> a single target attacker for HT, even if your single target got buffed I ain't getting you because your single target is still subpar to the single target classes out there.

    Stop trying to imagine heroes as a one class fit all class where if people are r> single target they'll take heroes and if they're r> cleave they'll take heroes too. No buff will fix this. It's a problem with the bosses in the game rn that just heavily favours ranged.

    That's not to say you can't do end game content. It's just more vital that you find the right people and right connections who will want you on their runs. There are heroes who do pb, there are heroes who do 6man HT. You just need to find the right people and the right comp to make things work.

    It's not that I think this is how the game should work, but it's how the game IS actually working. These buffs you're mentioning don't solve the underlying problem and won't make you any more attractive when trying to join random runs.
     
    • Agree Agree x 9
  3. OP
    OP
    Magen
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    Magen Selkie Jr.

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    1:46 AM
    bishopmage
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    You are really underated me for no reason
    I was leading you to this point therefore you explained my point out of Enrage suggestion.
    No for the 3rd time I don't want you to take heros on top of NL or range
    But I think hero's should get buff on the single attack so they could be MORE attractive recurring.
    So yes, again getting a single attack terms buff is necessary.
    In my point of view DK's doing well in cleaving and paladin has its own buffs that making him good in terms in single attack and also HH skill makes his DPM really great (before the need)
    Yes I think there is a place for hero's to be taken as cleave and then when cleave is no more needed switch to single attack. No don't worry it won't white your godly NL or what ever range class you trying to defend.
    Btw
    I think you make your point very clear
    Hero's for you is just echo mule.
    There is no need to repeat on that cause you make your point very clear and it's also prove my point about HH and Enrage suggestion
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  4. Haaaaayyyyy
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    Haaaaayyyyy Red Snail

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    Oct 23, 2020
    5:46 PM
    I thought a bit about these two comments. Paladins have received a ton of buffs. But what limits their potential are elemental resistances. This might be controversial, but another suggestion that I might have is to debuff fire charge to 165% and remove fire resistance from PB and Krex. This will prevent a never ending power creep but at the same time put them near the same damage category as heros for these two bosses. This will also create a significant enough incentive to get holy charge during 4th job for certain other bosses.

    I also think HH doesn't really need to be touched. HH is mainly used for grinding just like how taunt is mainly used for grinding for shads.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  5. -ovv
    Online

    -ovv Horntail

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    3:46 PM
    -ovv
    Beginner
    200
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    wat
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  6. Jaewonnie
    Offline

    Jaewonnie Capt. Latanica

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    Crimsonwood Mountain: Cavern of Pain
    6:46 PM
    PAWGChamp
    Buccaneer
    It's not worth your effort dude. You're talking to a wall
     
    • Agree Agree x 5
  7. mjk
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    mjk Master Chronos

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    3:46 PM
    MattNL
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    Why don't you add disagree options with all of the proposed changes instead of just agree options so we can see how the community actually feels instead of just speculating
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • Like Like x 1
  8. Cak33
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    Cak33 Headless Horseman

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    7:46 AM
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    Well you did really totally miss his point. What he say is, unless hero's single target is buffed to match BM or NL, heroes still wont be picked for PB. This is not a matter of how low heroes's damage is, its juz a matter of how high NL and BM's damage are. People will only pick the best they can find, and not average.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  9. RegalStar
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    RegalStar Nightshadow

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    DMsRebirth
    And even if hero's single target damage is buffed to NL/archer level I doubt people will pick that guy in their runs at this point lol
     
  10. porl
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    porl Mixed Golem

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    10:46 AM
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    Pasta
    I feel like heroes are just picked as a pity slot on any non JC/CWK/ZAK arm run, especially random runs. I understand why heroes are designed the way they are, it doesn't make it any better when you have things like the recent HT aggro changes pretty much obliterating any demand for non DK/shad cleave, making another boss heroes are less relevant in. If anything you're picked as a scuffed sed-mule when a shad isn't available. As a former hero player, I felt largely the same way to many people in this topic, but I just ended up quitting my hero and making a ranged char instead.

    It feels like there's little reason to play a hero over DK atm & I don't see any changes happening anytime to change that. I see heroes becoming like paladins in a way, in terms of popularity
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  11. Cak33
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    Cak33 Headless Horseman

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    Why not tho. If Heroes w/ SI + SE = NL w/ SE, there will be a lesser need for DKs for a party, no HB required as many had washed to 30k.
    Tho, heroes will be too OP at this point, so I'm sure it won't be implemented this way.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  12. RegalStar
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    RegalStar Nightshadow

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    DMsRebirth
    Well if I want to recruit a Hero for whatever reason, I wouldn't recruit that person in particular. I'd take any other Hero over them.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  13. Cak33
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    Cak33 Headless Horseman

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    ohh, took me awhile to get what yr trying to say, oops
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  14. Nise
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    Nise Supervisor Staff Member Supervisor Game Moderator

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    8:46 AM
    NoraONE
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    Sweetdreams
    Since it seems a lot of people found the poll to be misleading, I took the liberty to edit the OP's poll to include "disagree" options. Hope you don't mind! bishopmagebishopmage
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  15. OP
    OP
    Magen
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    Magen Selkie Jr.

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    Thank you for the help!
    While the guy just focused on single attack only I understand his point about that, and I think he is right.
    But while that true I was talking about bosses that has cleave and single terms.
    In that terms I think my suggestion will help abit.
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  16. Cak33
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    Cak33 Headless Horseman

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    Maybe the main issue is not about Heroes lacking low single-target DPM, but rather bosses not friendly with cleave meta.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Great Work Great Work x 2
  17. OP
    OP
    Magen
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    Magen Selkie Jr.

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    As I feel the aggressive comments here, not even about the suggestions but on me specific. I wrote some points that makes Enrage odd.
    I would like to get the community thoughts about the following, some of the points i wrote earlier on page 3 but some of them didnt get any attention:
    1. compare a 4th skill to a potion or boss buff - Energizer gives you straight 30mins of 25 weapon attack with no CD VS Enrage 4/8 - 28 mins ish in 1 hour . Energizer/boss buff is better because it last longer with no use of skill points.
    2. compare it to concentrate - Enrage CD longer than concentrate - 8minutes for Enrage, 6 minutes for concentrate; concentrate has better CD which makes it better.
    3.claim that Enrage gives nearly 7 levels by adding 6 WA :
    this is all true while you are not in the 2nd run of HT or simply not use any kind of potion that overrides it, Also you cant use apple and Enrage for example
    which means you cant refer it to straight +6weapon attack skill because it can be override by another potion.
    4. this is more like a question -
    at vanilla maple Enrage was +26 and rage +12? (althought i remember rage as +16 but maybe Im wrong) - so Enrage should buff +10 than rage /+14 than other best potion?
    If so, that shows why this skill on this version isnt more relevant -> ratio of weapon attack on skills/potion changed and Enrage remain the same?
    5. by using Enrage, the hero must to recharge his combos and it means about 5-7 attacks to get it back to fully charged
    also, when you lose your combo you also lost the chance to hit panic/comma which is -100k to -200k hits
    lets take the best option of lossing 100k hit from panic + 6 attack back to get combo - you will loose about 150 to 200k for get that extra +6 att.
    the worst case lets say comma+8 hits to charge back combo - hero will lose about 200 to 400k ish by using Enrage.
    while compare it to concentrate of archers, they dont lose any kind of combo buff during doing that.
     
  18. JDPJHC
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    JDPJHC Mixed Golem

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    6:46 PM
    JDPJHC
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    As someone that has extensively played the Hero class, and would also benefit heavily from Hero buffs, I still can't justify a buff for our class (the only thing I would change is the META of HT). Our class is actually really strong if you gear your character properly (as are most classes lol). A lot of you are crying for balance changes when you haven't even gone through the trouble of actually playing and gearing your Hero. You guys dont even try to truly optimize your DPM. You just want your class to be easier so you don't have to do so.

    I still feel like the last Enrage buff was a bit stupid (no need to make our class even more brain dead). If Heros cant even keep track of DP timers to use Enrage properly, I personally dont think they deserve to have the Enrage buff up anyways. Enrage has never been an attack POTION. It should be dispelled just as skills and buffs get dispelled.

    I've never had any trouble joining any boss runs. Even those that are single target bosses. Perhaps you guys should look towards other reasons of why you're not being invited.

    This thread is full of trolls at this point, people are commenting on balance changes even though they haven't even leveled their Hero, let alone even put point into Enrage.

    I hope people are taking note of the kinds of comments being left on this thread when considering future warriors for their runs :rolleyes::rolleyes:.
     
    • Agree Agree x 5
    • Great Work Great Work x 2
    • Like Like x 1
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  19. OP
    OP
    Magen
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    Magen Selkie Jr.

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    My hero is just fine with funding thanks for asking. No yet perfect weapon but it's funded enough.
    I'm not asking for too much; though I have some points I would you to react to.
    concentrate cd Vs Enrage cd, the need of cancel ACA to use enrage and ofc that you can't benefit from this skill if you eat apple or any other pot.
    Basically it's 2 to 5 sections from previous comment :)
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  20. JDPJHC
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    JDPJHC Mixed Golem

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    6:46 PM
    JDPJHC
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    If you really believed your hero was fine you wouldnt be asking for buffs :rolleyes:
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
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