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would this set my battleship to 1 hp?

 

my perspective is that of a bishop player, I believe this suggestion harms gameplay and mostly helps mules.
dispels have animations and timers that announce them and in content like HT skilled active players can make use of iframes to avoid death. What you are proposing gets rid of this mechanic and replaces it with spamming magic guard during the 1 second of grace. Player skill and sense of danger gone.
1 second of grace or really any period of grace is too generous and basically makes dispel a very laughable mechanic, plus it's mostly a buff to the mules, the stationary substitutes that can't do more than 'spamming mg' in the face of dispels. Look at the bishop mules in pink bean, with a second of grace or whatever would there even be a threat when Ariel and Right Man dispels are triggered? what's that for a mule with triple magic guard macro. Comfort for the substitutes.
Bishops ability of survival, whether its skill or HP, is a big part of what makes them desirable for some content and making dispel easy like this lowers the floor too much and gives more field to the hoards of substitutes that would be enabled when dispel is nerfed.
I care about the viability of my class and for example I can currently run aufheben because I am reliable, some have tried mule'ing a bishop there and obviously without success but with your proposal I can see it happening 100%, rather than helping 'real players'.

 

While I don’t disagree with your points, I’d much rather have what separates a good and bad bishop be effectiveness rather than ability to stay alive. Having the skill floor set to “can you stay alive and not grief the run” rather than “can you be a contributing member of the party” is a pretty unforgiving entry point for what’s considered an important but unrewarding role for end game content.

I’d personally like to see a world where staying alive as a Bishop isn’t locked behind excessive washing goals, but being effective and contributing to the run is challenging and something that can be practiced without fear of randomly dying and potentially ending a run.

Even if a first time Bishop had a 0% chance of dying in HT, you would still value a veteran bishop over them due to their practiced skills at performing important duties that are considered vital to the run. Personally I think that’s a healthier way of distinguishing players; obviously there’s the issue of mulability but with good fight design (such as HT) an active bishop still justifies its spot over a mule. I’d rather fights give bishops more things to do and limited windows to do them rather than just trying their hardest to kill the bishop.

just my 2c anyways I think you still have very valid concerns

 

I agree with you but I'm far too pessimistic about bosses design, Horntail is a unique case. If we are talking about pinkbean and aufheben, bosses that don't meet HT standards, the endgame community would rather always mule a bishop than get 'the most effective, the best player, the strongest' because no matter how good or strong you are the class is way to weak and replaceable to justify their presence in endgame PB runs, unless you mule something else.

I'm afraid what keeps bishops relevant in aufheben is their ability of survival rather than their skill or damage, and if beefy bishop mules were common I probably wouldn't even get to play that boss. In an ideal world I would like it to be like what you are saying but I guess I'm currently on side of trying to preserve the little we have rather than enabling mules harder.

 

More than fair. I guess my wishes are a bit idealist in nature; in practice what you’re saying is unfortunately true. One can wish though

 

Hello guys! Wanted to share my thoughts on the suggestion. I think the suggestion is a brilliant idea, and somewhat solves the unresolved issue of aufheben hp on challenge characters (or the average player). I think that the concerns raised by vowels are very legit and not only would we see bishop muled, even HB mules would be very easy to include (i present full luk DK with stance to stay in range for dps). I believe it's a slipery slope as to what can be done about the problem but that's to be expected due to the flawed nature of hp washing as a mechanic. Perhaps as the OP mentioned the defense rework solves the problem but if this is the only boss in which this problem stands (which to my knowledge it is) i think changing the mechanics of this boss fight itself is healthier than changing dispel as a whole. I'm certain there are other ways to make this fight challenging without dispel being a core aspect of it (this way challenge hp is enough)! I confess ive never done aufheben but what would seem obvious to me would be to make sed/dp share a cooldown or atleast when either is done add a 10 sec cd on the other to avoid the possibility to get DP'd while in sed or dp and insta sed as these are scenarios where underwashed characters are leaving their life to complete rng. I think the dispel itself is an attack which means you get iframes after it so this should allow HB/MesoG/MagicG to be casted safely and if it's not, this addition could also be considered.

 

Core blaze and auf haven are 2 bosses that both stand out as content which contains unique mechanics, but yet while the former has become a well received staple of high level bossing, the latter has become extremely niche content which is almost universally hated and run very rarely.

While part of this is certainly due to the rewards (make auf haven helm not one of a kind kekw), a large factor for this discrepancy is due to the fact that auf haven is both extremely difficult and unfun to run. To make your auf runs viable you need a fairly unique combination of classes and a fairly high bar for washing requirements, and even once you get in you are met with an hour of dispel spam which causes you to be rebuffing a quarter of the time.

I'm guessing the logic behind the dispel spam was to punish NLs due to their long shadow partner cast time, but I think the clone/healing system might already be sufficient for keeping range down.

 

how auf dispels work? it's like ht or it gives some dmg at same time?

 

Auf Haven has an attack which shoots a big blue orb, upon getting hit by it you get dispelled.
It seems to be proximity based as well, almost as if she 'senses' players standing on the right side, she will cast the Orb attack more often.

She also has a global dispel which is not an attack, which is cast every 90 seconds, kinda like Horntail's Mid head dispel.

For Warriors or Buccs, one thing they can do to avoid the Orb attack Dispel is when she's about to use the Orb attack (her blue aura behind her will come in front, one can use Rush/Corkscrew blow to tank her damage, kinda like avoiding the totems in Zakum, but with less reaction time.

FYI i use 2000 honsters per Auf Haven run i am losing money every run

 

so it can cast the dispel like mid head on Ht and hit right after like a perfect frame? or is there any trick to avoid that?

 

It does seem likely yes, let me render a video to show you how it looks like

 

you can tank the orb but not the global dispel as I could see? but since it's just a single mob (and not multiple mobs like ht), i guess you can just hold magic guard right after global dispel and you won't get another hit?

 

Correct, one of the killer combos would be the Stun+Seduce combo, when that happens, you are unable to move nor use Hero's Will. If a Dispel orb comes while in that scenario + an attack after, Mage attackers will die.

Another scary one is if she walks.

 

Since it can help mules and annoy the gameplay like the main bs said, what if some buffs got a faster cast?

 

That's a good suggestion but about magic guard idk, they can just make hero will works on stuns so mages have more counterplay even without wash?
But HyperBody and MesoGuard definitely deserve it

 

Increased Angel Ray damage when?

 

Perhaps maybe her orb dispels could have a longer delay on cast animation or a longer delay on dispel affecting players instead. Whereas map wide dispel could get a higher evasion chance % say 25%.