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Important HP thresholds

Discussion in 'Guides' started by Selquin, Jun 13, 2020.

  1. Selquin
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    Selquin Headless Horseman

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    "How much HP should I aim for?"
    I'm sure we have all heard this annoying question way too many times. Instead of being forced to type a wall of text each time, it would be nice to have a list of important HP thresholds to reference and let wide eyed newbies decide for themselves. So, here is a list of HP important list of HP thresholds that I am aware of, consider it a sequel to What it means for HP washing to be optional on maplelegends

    *keep in mind some of these thresholds are not exact

    7k HP
    - able to barely survive HT without HB
    This is the minimum amount of HP to be reasonably able to do HT. You can do it with less, but would require having HB on your character at all times, which is not practical. Keep in mind that the legs+tail can still kill you in 1 hit(unless you have HB), which means you will have to stay on the top left platform until the leg+tail is dead. Unless you purposely limit yourself to not doing any amount of washing at all, which in my opinion is just stupid, this should be a very easy threshold to hit for lvl ~160 characters.

    8.1k HP
    - able to tank 2 hits from HT with HB
    This is an extremely important threshold. Aside from leg+tail, HT can hit a maximum of ~6.5k with a wing boosted magic attack, which means you need around 13k HP or 8.1khp + HB to be able to tank 2 hits. Being able to survive 2 hits from HT without dying makes your life incomparably easier. You will no longer die from missing missing a single pot input after 1 hit.

    ~8.5k HP
    - able to survive Vergamot with HB
    - able to survive touch damage from scarlion phase 3
    - able to survive targa

    The 3rd phase of verga has some attacks which hit for roughly ~13.5k damage, you can now survive this with HB. These attacks are actually all avoidable, and by some classes like BM relatively easily, but its pretty likely for you to mess up 1-2 dodges over the course of a kill.

    Most of the time you would need to touch scar's third body, but for the odd scenario where you need to get past him or something it could be slightly useful

    Targa is pretty aids to kill, and most of the time you wont have HB. If you plan on selling some Targa helms, or willing to do some work for the potential +2 int on your mage this can be useful.


    ~9k hp - able to survive dunas without HB
    Dunas has a strong attack, which can be relatively easily avoided, which hits around 9k (I could be remembering wrong), you can now survive it.

    9.2k HP - able to do toad with HB
    You will be able to barely survive a toad attack with HB from full HP. I personally think toad is a garbage boss and a hilarious waste of time,but nevertheless the threshold is listed here.

    ~9.5k HP
    - able to survive leg+tail in HT without HB
    You can now survive the leg+tail phase of HT without having to hide on the top platforms. This is pretty useful but not absolutely necessary. There are some situations where your dpm is needed on the leg/tail and you might not always have HB. This also gives you leeway if you fall down from the top plat with no HB. Once you are at this point, you can do HBless runs without a problem, but you have to be pretty confident in your potting skills as you still get 2hit koed. A lot of oldschool characters that aren't washed very hardcore end up around this HP range.

    11.5k HP
    - able to survive any hit from PB with HB
    - survive nameless magic atk with HB
    - able to tank a hit from BF
    This would be the amount of HP required to survive all PB hits with HB.

    This amount of HP( or somewhere around here at least) will also allow you to survive the highest damage attack from nameless. This particular attack can be avoided a lot of the time if you have someone in your party that can pin nameless, in which case you just make sure to stand out of range of its red magic claw attack. Still this threshold gives you some leeway, and gives you the option of doing nameless without a pinner.

    I don't do BF, but apparently this is useful if you mess up your pin and need to get through BF.


    13k HP
    - able to survive 2 hits from HT WITHOUT HB
    In my opinion, if you are planning on making a well washed ranged attacker, this is the most important threshold to aim for. For aforementioned reasons, it is extremely important to be able to tank 2 hits from HT. This means that being able to live 2 hits without HB opens up the door for comfortable HT runs without HB. As you get into higher level and smaller HT squads, HB will not always be available, so having this option is very important. For the purposes of HT, having HP beyond this point is a mere luxury.

    13.5k HP
    - able to survive vergamot without HB

    ~13.6k hp
    - able to tank a HT leg touch hit boosed by the wing buff without HB
    If for some reason you find yourself running into HT legs, your blunder will not cost your life. Not a very relevant threshold.

    ~14.5k HP
    - able to tank a Horntail left/right head without HB.
    On HT runs without HB this can be slightly useful. Occasionally you can get mass sed and walk into the left or right head, and often you wont be able to react to will out before you can avoid touching a head. Having this threshold allows you to tank 1 head touch before immediately willing out or getting healed.

    14.6k HP
    - able to survive toad without HB
    If you for some reason find yourself wanting to toad, this is often useful because dks dont really like to do toad(they cant zerk). Congratulations, you can kill a garbage boss without HB now.

    15k HP
    -Able to tank PB touch damage with HB

    After running a couple of PBs, I have concluded that its actually pretty damn helpful to be able to tank PB's touch damage, particularly for classes that cannot easily get over its body. This could change depending on how PB strategy evolves, but as of now being able to switch sides is pretty useful.

    ~19k
    - able to theoretically survive PB without HB
    - able to survive nameless magic attack without HB
    - able to survive HT mid head touch damage without HB
    Congratulations, you can survive everything in the game short of an HT tail touch damage without any pathetic dark knights.

    24k hp
    -able to tank PB touch damage without HB
     
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  2. akashsky
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    akashsky Horntail

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    12k hp for boosted legs touch is wrong. I have died too many times to jumping into legs. Unbuffed hits ~10k, and buffed has hit me as high as 13.6k
     
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  3. Chew
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    Chew Headless Horseman

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    Unrelated, but im considering what my goal HP should be for my assassin. Since 13k seems unachieveable to me. Would you bring along a NL with 8.1k HP?
     
  4. akashsky
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    akashsky Horntail

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    I think nowadays whats more important is how often a runner dies and how much damage a runner does throughout the run, rather than specifically how much HP they have.

    A good player can survive with 8.1k hp. So if you have decent gears + don't die often in HT i don't think theres any problem bringing you into HT.

    Assuming you are talking about 1 party runs:

    The real problem I think is a social one. Whenever I host a run, I don't want to take anyone that I don't personally know, or know of. Killing horntail is a big time commitment, so I don't want to run with anyone that I don't trust.

    I would not want to recruit a random NL with 8.1k hp. If I personally knew that 8.1k HP NL and know that they are good at HT, then there is no problem.


    Assuming you are talking about 2 party runs:

    Just join a decent guild / cross guilds bossing discord. Most of the stronger guilds host 2 party runs every week. I see so many of them and they are willing to take anyone who wants to come, (like AGAPE for example).
     
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  5. Oradious
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    Oradious Capt. Latanica

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    No
     
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  6. nanop33
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    nanop33 Capt. Latanica

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    This. I've gotten one-shot without HB with around 6.7-6.8k HP + meso guard trying to Assaulter up to the wings zzzzz
     
  7. RegalStar
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    RegalStar Nightshadow

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    I've seen boosted leg quake do ~9560 to me, and I had decent defense (but no HT buff). I'd say more like 9.7-9.8k is best to ensure you can survive legs. Tail hit for much less so if you have like 9k you can jump down and hit tail after legs are dead, but I never bothered to find out how much boosted tail can hit for (since I don't get hit very often by it to begin with).

    At around 9k is also a very important threshold for HT as this means you can survive a boosted wing slap. Without this much HP, every time you climb the right side rope to the top you risk getting slapped and killed on the spot unless you time your iframes or go in dark sight or something, and you have to keep back even once you get on the top plat.

    I've never seen verga 3rd form hit me for more than 13k, so I think around 13.2k should suffice in surviving it.
     
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  8. Althariisa
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    Althariisa Slimy

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    MrPresidentMrPresident OnionMuhaOnionMuhaOnionMuhaOnionMuhaOnionMuhaOnionMuhaOnionMuhaOnionMuhaOnionMuhaOnionMuhaOnionMuhaOnionMuha HAHAHHAHHHAHAHAHAHAHAH
     
  9. aaronis
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    aaronis Slimy

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    hello skarmory i am very big fan ty for ur hard work on the forums, anyways i am wondering what is hp threshold for jiaocheng and the anego rooty tooty point and shooty and slap because i feel like those are also important thresholds for ranged classes, also maybe add zakum threshold because maybe level 50s are curious idk? ty for ur time keep up the great work
     
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  10. OP
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    Selquin
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    Selquin Headless Horseman

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    I'm gunna need to bring in an expert for those jiao/anego thresholds, since of course we don't engage in these ludicrous levels of inefficient gameplay here.
     
  11. RegalStar
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    RegalStar Nightshadow

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    Jiaoceng is about 8k at the moment (he used to have an 11k attack but it's gone). Anego is 5.5k for surviving the gun (which might actually hit you).
     
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  12. Huiae
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    Huiae Headless Horseman

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    Hello. I wrote a guide for washing recently and saw this, noticed itll be nice if readers see both together.

    May i ask youre good with my making a link on my guide, to yours?

    (Hoped to ask in private with convo but seems you blocked so asking here.)
     
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  13. OP
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    Selquin
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    Selquin Headless Horseman

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    Sure thing you can use this info dump however you like
     
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  14. Slime
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    Slime Pixel Artist Retired Staff

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    Good read. :thumbsup:
     
  15. eeto
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    eeto Mano

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    Thank you for this :)

    Could I request tho, for the convenience of other new players in the future, to add the general level range or minimum level someone goes to even attempt those specific bosses?
     
  16. Thuglifer
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    Thuglifer Capt. Latanica

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    no general lvl range but it's based on the party's ability to clear the run. A good rule of thumb is boss level -5 = min level req for most runs as players would be in exp leech range and only incurr a 5% dmg reduction

    how do drk's currently perform in this segment in terms of survivability rate and dependency of pb pin placement (is it worth the risk and movement away from body for distancing measures to zerk)? knowing that a max of 18,000 hp is req to keep zerk up.
     

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