Neo Tokyo Bosses' droprates

1) It makes sense for neo tokyo to have less monetary reward than content like horntail or cwkpq because it is EASIER to do.

Cwkpq requires you to gather up 10 characters (*not necessarily people*) and the bosses have ~1b combined HP.

Horntail is the most difficult boss in ML and 1 party runs require strong people and can take 90 minutes.

In 90 minutes, I could join a 1 party run and clear a horntail. In that same 90 minutes, I could kill nibergen and nameless TWICE, by MYSELF without anyone else. Furthermore, with horntail, you are either forced to do the painful prequest again and again or are confined to horntail cave.

With Neo toyko you don't have this problem. You can leave the area whenever you want and enter whenever you want after you have done the painful prequests once.

With that established, I would say that 1 horntail run in terms of time / effort commit = 8 runs of neo tokyo bosses (doing 2 of each boss). So 1 horntail run should give you more value than 8 neo tokyo boss runs (as neo tokyo is still easier content to finish and requires less startup time since people do not need to do a painful prequest again and again).

Since 1 HT run is about 160m profit, I would say that we can safely buff neo tokyo drops such that 8 runs yields LESS than 160m profit.

 

Hello

 

Every nt boss is super easy, can be cheesed and can be afk'd
Just don't have a meme set up like having shadower and a dk.
I do not think it needs a drop rate buffs.

or remove nt equip drops and buff crafting materials.

 

Comparison is still valid in terms of ppl and time required to kill HT / NT. Total HP in HT is 2,740,000,000 HP Total HP from 2x nameless + 2x nib +2x verga + 2x dunas is 2*(430+350+300+230)
is 2.63b. Which is actually less than HT.

If you need 4 ppl to finish a run in 30 minutes, you would probably need 2 parties to finish HT in 90 mins.

 

Hi akash

160m/8 runs would be 20m profit per NT run. Since HT requires the painful prequest, say you chop off 5m profit for NT run, leaving it at 15m profit per run. That would be pretty fair.

I'm not sure if I'm just super unlucky with NT but in the last ~20 runs I've done, I don't think I've gotten a single crafting material, MTK/flairgrave, or meaningful scroll drop. AKA 0 profit.

I think it's fine leaving MTK and flairgrave as rare drops. But if it were up to me, I would boost scroll drop rates, maybe to 30-50%, so that you at least get a scroll drop every 2-3 runs. It won't be game breaking. It doesn't have to be a shield att 60%. It can be other scrolls that are worth just 3-5m.

Thoughts?

 

Only nibergen and dunas cancel. Horntail Preheads cancel as well and you can't move to a different part. Furthermore, at neo tokyo, classes do alot more damage since there isn't any falling off platforms or significant time lost to repositioning.

If you had a single party try to clear all NT bosses, and then have that same party try to clear horntail, which would finish first?

Once again, I agree that a buff might be needed, but I just want to make it clear that it should not be buffed to be more profitable than HT, which imo is harder to clear content.

I agree that 15m profit per run seems fair. Aimerrythm claimed above to have made 3b from 200 runs, which is actually 15m profit per run. I don't know how accurate this is , but if it is accurate than NT is actually in a good spot.

I actually think the best thing to do here as far as balancing goes might be to just remove the NT weapons from being drops all together and just buff smaller drops (scrolls, equips, crafting materials), such that on average you gain ~10-15m per run. The extreme RNG of neo tokyo weapons dropping (as when a max stat drops its a BIG payout but its extremely rare) makes the content feel pretty punishing and unmotivating for people unwilling to run hundreds of times.

 

To expand on Akash's calculations, I'm going to use myself as an example, since I play a class that doesn't do significantly more (cleaves) or less (sairs, paladin to some extent) damage in HT compared to NT, and I don't multiclient attackers.

In HT my DPM45 is around 5m with SI and 4.6-4.7m or so without. Roughly extrapolating my prehead damage as maybe around 5.5m-6m and estimating my total damage over a 90 min HT run, I can contribute to (very roughly) around 1/6 of the damage needed to kill HT, so using 160m as an estimate of HT's total worth, my claim to running HT in a suitably sized party would be something like 26m over 90 min, or around 17.7m/hour. My NT solo times are around 50-55min for Verga, 65-70min for Dunas and 75min for Nameless (I don't do Nib because it sucks for Marksmen and its drop pool also sucks). I'll assume an average of around 65 min per solo, so in order for NT to be equal to HT the bosses would need to be worth 16.4m per kill. Of course, the fact that NT prequest is hard once per character while HT requires a lot of manon camping and cornian slaughtering is also there, so a ballpark of around 15m per NT boss would definitely seem reasonable.

But is NT boss really worth 15m per kill? Aimerrythm's claims seem to agree with it, but Akash's rough calculations in the money making tier list thread seem to indicate a totally difference story as his estimations come out more to the tune of 6.3m per kill. Trying to determine the true worth of NT bosses is exceedingly difficult because, unlike HT for whom a lot of detailed drop logs exist, most NT runs turn out to be complete duds and thus no one ever bothers keeping a drop log of their NT kills (this is also why I asked for a buff on the drop rate of the "low" prizes). I have started a spreadsheet today that I hope can be used to collect everyone's NT run data to get a better idea on how much NT bosses are roughly worth (link: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1CaOKqcG8F-KDkPsw4y6WkySKF006TzYYOtmFy3gZ6Ps). I hope that people who runs NT here can help me collect data to shed some light on this subject.

 

Does this game for attackers only 1way to farm mesos is HT？ if ppl need work，can just use 2hrs per day，nt bosses is the best
But the drop rare…
I just wanna say i dont want see bosses drop nothing or just 1card or a shit scroll

 

If you truly made 3b in 200 NT runs, I am really not sure what you are complaining about. My BM(as well as similar calibre pally/NL) can solo verg in roughly 30min and duo verg/nameless in 15-20min. If the profit is truly 15m per run, that means NT would close to 30m/hr, which would be about as good if not better than what I get at HT doing no attack pot 4-5man HT runs.

 

I mean my total nt runs till now，271verga 32dunas 153niber 157nameless

 

Forgive me idk how to put picture here@saar help me uplord my ss

 

Yes total 600 ntruns farmed 3b mesos
Sounds great

 

This would make much more sense, it would seem like your profit/run is closer to ~5m then, which seems to be in line with what others are saying.

 

ok we think it will use same time from 6 ntbosses run=1ht run, so my 600 ntbosses run=100ht run
as who says 100ht runs will drop 30*mw20 and 30*gen30?
it only worth 3b?