Clarifying streamer giveaway/RWT guidelines

I think there's many things to take into account

The most common problem is donation goals on streamers which is the most wild form of RWT in the game
Many streamers often make the mistake of doing this and i've seen which i had to advise against.

''If we get $200 dollar donation goal i'll host a zakum run for viewers''
It's clearly giving in game advantage through direct money

Raffles are the same, raffles for amount of subs or amount of watchers of anything with all ads, just makes streamers pursue earning a bigger following by using in game advantages.
Getting more viewers or subs = more ads or subscriptions = more money
How to get more of that , giving items away.

Even channel points can be linked by donation
Gifted subs and donations can directly increase channel points and nothing stops streamers or watchers from taking advantage
Even if it was a crazy amount, people who put direct money on it would have an advantage over others, while making the in game advantage of items or carries into a transaction which is what they try to avoid

While this hurts people who just want to help people who just watch or enjoy their content the truth is, there's too much power and possiblity on this.
So the best agreement is to just simply don't use any ingame advantage to ''sell yourself'' on Twitch.
Because even if YOU aren't earning money through watchers, others definitely can.

 

I find that using Channel Points to give away an in game item, or provide some additional in game service to people (such as hosting a significant boss run) is sus and shouldn't be allowed or should have specific guidelines for it. Channel Points shouldn't be used in exchange for any real or virtual currency (should be part of the Twitch TOS) and if it's used to give an ign item away, then that can in turn be used for mesos gains.

Channel Points should be used as an additional way for viewers to interact with the streamer, and not for an avenue where viewers can gain something in ML by being long time viewers of a specific channel. Maybe if the raffle/giveaway was extremely trivial to obtain, like 100 points, 1 time entry, a weeks notice so anyone can get points for it. But that opens the door for more ambiguity and too much gray area.

For advertising streams thru smegas/discord, maybe there should be a "No self advertising" rule, similar to what reddit has. Although I guess that would be hard to determine who's self advertise on smegas, cause it could be smega mules. Not sure how critical this topic is though.

I do agree that since the Christmas event, there's been more and more steamers on Legends (sometimes up to 15 at the same time) and it's getting to the point where detailed rules and explanations should be out into effect for what you can/cannot do on stream.

 

I think with channel points it shouldn't matter because its basically a way to get people to engage in something, when one uses channel points the streamer doesn't get money for redeeming the points its just a way to have a community get engaged with others watching the streamer, so if a MapleLegends streamer is getting banned because of channel points getting redeemed for something thats in-game is really silly because when channel points are redeemed the streamer doesn't get anything out of it because like you said

this shouldn't be considered RWT/RMT because nothing is really getting traded for it, unless the streamer is partnered or an affiliate they won't get paid from ads so gaining viewers wouldn't get them paid passively so in turn trading channel points for a Zhelm, HTP or the like is the same as just doing it for free in-game, channel points isn't a currency that gives the streamer cash money in their pockets its a system that makes it fair to raffle they aren't paying money for channel points they aren't breaking any rules, rather I don't see a rule being broken the streamer is pretty much playing a game that NexonTakedown would go over and get their streams banned.

Channel points is just a fair way to get someone something that the streamer can give back to their community for free, if someone is getting banned from a game giving away in-game goodies for a free system that the streamer gets nothing from then how is that deemed "RWT/RMT"?

 

I think the current ToS is pretty explicit. Whether channel points is free or not, it's still a third party currency which is clearly against the terms. Pixel also mentioned that sub does increase the rate of channel points gain.

I think it would be better to modify Soliciting part of ToS to explicitly allow advertising streams every 24 hours or whatever, if ML wants to allow advertising streams in game/discord.

I can't speak for staffs about "global and full-setup" but I imagine it's similar to "no purchase necessary" for irl raffles that corporates do. If above suggestion gets approved, you should be able to advertise your stream along with the giveaway, but it'd just have to be "oh also i stream if you want to check it out." Maybe they'll even allow saying that the giveaway results will be on stream.

Guild giveaways are a bit different because they're in-game group unlike a third party stream, and the guilds usually have nothing to gain since it's mostly among guild/alliance members, and doesn't use a third party currency.

 

Twitch allows gift sub as a channel points reward. Not sure if they allow game items and/or cash rewards.

 

Channel points only unlock if you're affiliated, which means streamers do get money from ads (which cannot be disabled) or subs. Plus viewership in itself is what streamers need/want.

 

Do they really? That seems strange to me.

Here's what Twitch says on their Channel Points Acceptable Use Policy

Do not sell, offer to sell, trade, barter, or transfer Points to other users of Twitch in exchange for Bits or in exchange for real or virtual currencies inside or outside the Twitch Services. Any attempted prohibited sale or transfer will be null and void.

https://www.twitch.tv/p/en/legal/channel-points-acceptable-use-policy/

Not sure about gifted subs, but that's probably where the restriction for in game currency is established

 

He means the viewer can cash in channel points in trade for the streamer to gift them a sub.

(A few league of legends streamers do this)

 

I actually love seeing people smega promoting friend's streams; one of the most charming parts about ML is the community's willingness to celebrate each other's hobbies and achievements. I don't think streamer [self or otherwise] promotion is something that needs to be tracked with a timer since it can be managed through the spamming clause in the ToS. Like BentPaw pointed out, keeping track of alts and such would be more headache than it is probably worth. However, completely banning self promotion would be a disappointment to me, as sometimes people start streaming & self promote in hopes of making some new friends.
obviously coming from an extremely biased perspective, so take what I say with a grain of salt

I do agree having some more explicit guidelines around channel point usage would be great. There are a lot of innovative channel point reward ideas floating around, and I believe many of them are not in conflict with the RWT rules. Would love to see some rewards be officially sanctioned.

 

What is the most value a streamer can get from this anyways? Is this really a way to efficiently sell mesos? There's already an exception on this server for selling art. I feel like streaming should also get an exception. You can ban certain things like giving in game rewards for monetary donations, but channel points seem like negligible value. I am okay with viewers getting free boss loot for viewing.

 

Popularity = watchers = Subs and donations = money
In exchange of advertised potential goods

Offering in game advantages even if small, will boost your audience, which on Twitch is definitely profitable , on a platform such a Twitch
The thing is not if it efficient or not, the thing is that it exists

Art is different cuz on art is more like a regulated through forum trade between art for meso, while as an artist myself still dont understand the reasoning behind this
I still don't get real money for art made through this server
However streamers eventually get money through watchers via Twitch

And that's where the problem lies

 

Yes, I understand that. But how much money? Is there an easy way to abuse it? Are there better ways of regulating it than just a blanket no?

I think it's good that we have streamers with boosted viewers and a decent audience community. I mean, why even advertise streamers every time I vote.

 

It's not a set amount of money
It could be little or a lot
Streaming and earning watchers through your own personality and content is fine, you earned those donations and those subscriptions yourself

But if people only subscribe and only donate, or hell only if they're gonna start watching because you're hosting a meso giveaway or a free run for watchers

You're basically earning potential income for giving in game goods.

 

Banning a streamer for 'RWT' under a gray area policy is pretty lol-worthy to me, especially if they were just trying to help promote the Legends community and there was no malicious intent found. It's not like these instances are happening in abundance where a black and white policy needs to be strictly enforced. If anything, it should be taken case-by-case. (Of course, until it becomes unmanageable, but we have only like 20 active streamers).

On the other hand, if you're a streamer, it's probably a good idea to keep in close communication with staff to green light any of your ideas that may be questionable.

 

Again, I understand that can happen. I'm asking for a discussion on how to limit or regulate it. For example, you could make it so that raffles or bossing incentives are never tied to donations (i.e accessible to only followers not just subs). You can also force streamers to show all donations on stream and record all the VODs. Players are already incentivized to report others for 10k nx if they see anything fishy.

So what are some edge cases? Suppose a streamer sets up a private stream with 1 viewer, and gives away 1b and lists his cashapp. Okay, but this already happens, just behind closed doors. Why go through this extra public step just to RWT. And just because there exists malicious ways to take advantage of streaming, it doesn't mean we should blanket ban all sort of streamer-viewer interaction.

 

Streamer giveaways should be lopped together with art commissions. In both cases as long as the magnitude of the wealth transferred is relatively small, the overall effect on the community is positive.