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Skill balances for all Jobs

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by KurayamiLove, Mar 27, 2019.

  1. KurayamiLove
    Offline

    KurayamiLove Windraider

    405
    463
    296
    Mar 15, 2015
    Female
    Nautilus
    12:06 PM
    KurayamiLove
    Buccaneer
    69
    Halcyon
    Introduction
    I still remember that big patch we got buffing most jobs and making them more relevant and fair compared to other jobs. I thought it would be cool to have another one like that with some balance changed I had in mind. I would like everyone to discuss the changes I will suggest, I'm interested in what you have to say about them and hear your ideas. I hope everything seems to find and maybe the GMs will give it a pass.



    [​IMG]
    Bowman
    [

    3rd JOB


    Arrow Rain/Eruption

    Damage increased from 160% to 200%
    Reasoning:

    Bowmaster grinding is a bit lacking and the only mobbing skill they have is Arrow Rain, buffing it a little would make them a bit better at killing groups of mobs. Why Eruption should get buffed too even tho Marksman is better at mobbing is simply because you cant buff one skill without buffing the other, both jobs should be equally good at 3rd job.

    4th JOB

    Dragon's Breath
    This skill should work on Boss summons
    This skill should work at close range
    Reasoning:
    The change on the boss summons is more of a change on how they are programmed than how this skill works, I learned that this skill with Ninja Storm are skills that can't push back bosses (and they shouldn't since I think only melee should be able to) but summons from them act as if they were some short of bosses (I know this because of a bug that let you knew the boss hp spread from an event boss to all bosses) . That change and the possibility of using this skill at close range would make all Bowmen able to defend themselves against any regular mob.


    Concentrate
    Reduce the cooldown to 240 seconds
    Reasoning:
    Concentrate is a very cool skill that most ppl would agree that it cooldown makes it not as good as it could be, reducing its cooldown it can be used all the time would make Bow Master a lot better, more weapon attack makes them less reliant on attack pots and the MP reduction would make the job less pot hungry (as it is now spamming hurricane makes Bow Master the most MP hungry job that isn't a mage spamming their map nuke). Also having the cooldown match the duration would make them also think about dispell times when comes to using the buff again.


    Blind
    Make this skill work on bosses
    Reasoning:
    This would give a boost to all Marksman as a utility job. Decreasing the accuracy of a boss would make easier for party members to avoid attacks from that boss. I know this would affect the highest avoidability jobs like thieves but I still think it can be a good change.

    [​IMG] [​IMG]
    THIEF
    1st JOB

    Double Stab
    Increase the damage from 130% to 170%
    Reasoning:
    Double Stab is objectively bad compared to Luky7, since Luky7 has its own formula that has mastery the moment you put 1 point into it (reliable dmg from lv1) as well as being a ranged skill that has better % on damage and gets broken the moment you have some attack gear (gloves or pots). To compete Double Stab would need to be stronger or at least the same % per hit.

    3rd JOB

    Chakra
    Remove the 50% HP requirement to cast.
    Reasoning:
    There is no reason to use this skill, maybe if the HP requirement is removed Chief Bandits would use this skill more often to heal themselves as they grind or boss. Even then using pots is more efficient when comes to dealing damage/grind.

    Shield Mastery
    Make this skill apply the buff to the total defense and only if a shield is equipped
    Reasoning:

    Shadower's most common shield is the Khanjar or Dragon Khanjar, shields with defenses bellow 10, even if they used the DEX shield they still have a stupidly low defense stat. Duplicating the defense a Chief Bandit has may sound op, but actually would reduce the physical damage but just a bit since the defense stat is a bit useless when comes to preventing damage, it would be more of a take a bit less damage skill.

    Band of Thieves
    Damage increase from 210% to 300%
    Reasoning:
    This skill is very underwhelming and could use more damage to be more efficient when comes to grinding. Chief bandit mobbing isnt that good outside meso explosion so let's make less funded people grind a lot better. This buff could also be used on 4th job.

    Shadow Meso
    Make it do damage over Weapon Cancel too
    Reasoning:
    This skill is useless as it is now, its utility is to ignore defense up buffs when dealing damage but Luky7 and Triple Throw are so powerful that no weapon defense up should make you use this skill over them anyways. Ignoring Weapon Cancel would make Hermits spend SP on this skill and give them some sort of way to keep doing damage even if the boss is putting the run on a stop (because that's what weapon cancel does, stops the run from progressing). I know the last thing the best job in dpm needs is a buff but I really thing this change would be pretty nice overal.

    4th JOB

    Ninja Ambush
    Increase the damage from 100% to 500%
    Reasoning:
    This skill is bad everyone knows this. I have done numbers and a Shadower using this skill with godly stats (1200 LUK 75STR) would do only 2550 damage per second with this skill maxed so pumping up the damage by a lot would make this skill ... still bad but usable on some situations like during cancels and perhaps on the beginning of bosses with multiple parts like HT or Zakum. The damage of that op stat shadower would go up from 2550 per second to 12750 per second (This skill only uses LUK and STR for dmg weapon attack is irrelevant).

    Ninja Storm
    Make this skill work on Bosses summons
    Reasoning:
    Like Dragon´s Breath this skill would be far more useful if it could get summons from bosses off you but as it is now they are like bosses and cant be pushed back by non-melee jobs.

    Smoke Screen
    Make all party members within the smoke screen avoid every single attack from all mobs, including status and even dispell.
    Reasoning:
    Smoke screen is an awesome skill but I dont see any Shadower on a party just because of that skill like you see a Bowman,Bishop or a DK. I think giving this skill the captabilities to avoid statuses and dispell would let everyone on the smoke to trully deal damage unterupted (unless a cancell pops up). Also I think this will make Shadowers think more about the timing when using this skill to prevent the most damage done to your team, timing status effects or dispells.





    [​IMG]
    WARRIOR
    2nd JOB

    Power Guard
    Duration increased from 90 seconds to 120 seconds
    Reasoning:
    The duration of this skills is way to short, if NEXON wanted this skill to be short I think it should last at least 120 seconds.

    Hyper Body
    Duration increased from 155 seconds to 200 seconds
    Reasoning:

    The standard for this kind of party skills is 200 seconds I'm not sure why NEXON gave this skill such an odd duration.

    3rd JOB

    Shield Mastery
    Make this skill work on the total defense instead of only the shield defense, also make this skill only work if a shield is equipped
    Reasoning:

    Same as Chief Bandit this skill is pretty much useless and doubling the defense of any warrior even tho they have one of the highest physical defense on the entire game won't make them op, they will take a bit less damage if they have a shield, this combined to Guardian would make shields worth a while.

    Elemental Resistance
    Make this skill work on physical hits as well
    Reasoning:
    Same as Achiles it would be cool if this skill worked on all kind of hits, this would only fix one issue all Elemental Resistance have gotten, and its HT left head´s elemental ice strike doing more damage that it should; also would help with future issues that elemental attacks may bring in the future.

    Spear/Polearm Crusher
    Attack speed increased -100ms per cast
    Speed table:
    OLD
    Speed Ms APM
    2 810 74
    3 870 69
    4 930 64
    5 990 60
    6 1050 57
    7 1140 52

    NEW
    Speed Ms APM
    2 710 84
    3 770 78
    4 830 72
    5 890 67
    6 950 63
    7 1040 57
    Reasoning:
    Crusher animation is very slow making the damage difference between a DK and any other warrior a bit too big. I have done a lot of damage test with numbers comparing DK to the other warriors and ended up with the conclusion that the new speed I suggest is the fairest, DK still below on damage compared to the other 2 warriors (but that is how it should be, it just needed an adjustment to be a bit closer to them since they risk more at 4th job to do damage). I've done my test even having in mind the different weapons multipliers (not axe tho, no one uses them) I suggested on another post to make it a bit more close to Hero´s and paladin's speed but watching the multipliers DK has the highest of all the three warriors making them gain more range easier so this way even on low funding DK still below the rest.

    4th JOB

    Holy/Divine Charge
    Damage increase from 140% to 160%
    Reasoning:

    As it is now this skill is useless and is outclassed by Lighting Charge. Most of the mobs that are weak to Holy are also weak to Lightning (at least the ones that you will kill past 4th job, when you get this new charge) The only mob that is weak to Holy and not to Lighting are the skelegons, and even then Heaven´s Hammer would do a better job killing them. Giving this charge a bit more damage over Lighting would make this Charge useful like the rest of the charges. I bet most paladins would like this change.

    Enrage
    Cooldown reduced to 240 seconds
    Reasoning:
    Heroes are the most ofensive oriented class in the game, making this skill available at all times is reasonable in my opinion, also would make heroes max this skill a bit earlier.. maybe. This skill would work pretty much like the Concentrate version I suggested here.

    Monster Magnet
    Success rate increase from 95% to 100%
    Reasoning:
    This skill is very underwhelming overall making it work all the time at max lv would be a nice touch.



    [​IMG] [​IMG]
    MAGICIAN

    3rd JOB

    Elemental/Partial resistance
    Make this skill work on physical attacks as well.
    Reasoning:
    Same issue with the HT left head´s ice attack being physical doing more damage than it should on people with Elemental Resistance, making this skill like Achiles affecting both physical and magic damage would make this kind o problem irrelevant in the future. Also, I have to add that a Bishop or an I/L Archmage can survive that ice strike after a dispell so having this skill to work on that attack is very important.

    4th JOB

    Infinity
    Duration increased from 40 seconds to 120 seconds
    Make it stop the MP usage from Magic Guard

    Reasoning:
    This skill is very useless as it is now I think a buff on duration and making it prevent all MP usage would make this skill useful, and I think more mages would look forward to using it.

    Mana Reflection
    Success rate increase from 60% to 100%
    Reasoning:
    This skill overall is very underpowered, making it always reflect damage would make this skill worth using adding a bit of damage on bossing (All mages do enough damage grinding to make this skill useless at grinding spots).





    [​IMG]
    PIRATE
    1st JOB

    Double Shot
    Damage increase from 110% to 150%
    Reasoning:
    I always felt like this skill is underpowered compared to Luky7 and Double shot (bowman)

    getting some more damage may give Gunslingers an easier time getting up to third job.

    2nd JOB

    Corkscrew Blow
    Target increase from 3 to 10
    Reasoning:

    I think is a good idea to match rush amount of mob hits to make this skill a bit better

    Backspin blow
    Target increase from 3 to 6
    Reasoning:
    Altho this skill is like rush I think is better to keep the targets down to 6 since this skill also stuns, stunning more targets would make this skill better in later jobs to combo with mobbing skills and gaining extra damage with Stun Mastery

    3rd JOB

    Charge
    Stance chance increase to 90%
    Reasoning:
    I really think Marauder stance chance should be the same as warriors, is ok since charge is a hard skill to get consistently, especially when you are attacking a single target.




    Conclusion
    I had a lot of changes in mind, like stance rate being 100%, a rework on Page´s magic crash that could make mobs stop using buffs for some time, huge buffs to assassinate like removing the need to go to dark sight and making the last hit not a rush. Lots of animations speed up to jobs like Buccaneer or Marksman to make some skill better. But I decided just to suggest the ones that are most likely to be added since many things are hardcoded and can't be changed. Thanks everyone for reading and have a good day.

     
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2019
    • Great Work Great Work x 11
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Funny Funny x 1
  2. Kimberly
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    Kimberly Administrator Staff Member Administrator Game Moderator

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    Sep 9, 2014
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    12:06 PM
    Moderator Post
    I suggest removing the black text cause its hard to read on dark themes.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  3. akashsky
    Online

    akashsky Windraider

    498
    77
    291
    Jun 10, 2017
    Male
    United States
    3:06 AM
    Akash
    Corsair
    140
    Vongola
    I really think its pointless to balance some attacking first job skills like double stab and double shot. They become obsolete once any player goes to second job or higher. I think the same is true for some third job skills - (though not arrow eruption or rain, as that is useful throughout an archers life).

    Also, it would help to have a DPS comparison list between all the classes on maplelegends with before/ after to see the impact of some of the heavier buffs (like Drk attack speed buff).

    I do think some underwhelming classes do need a buff. NL and sair feel a lot stronger than most other classes on maplelegends - and I often see them do equal damage to other classes even with a handicap of 120+ base int.
     
  4. OP
    OP
    KurayamiLove
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    KurayamiLove Windraider

    405
    463
    296
    Mar 15, 2015
    Female
    Nautilus
    12:06 PM
    KurayamiLove
    Buccaneer
    69
    Halcyon
    OHH what color should I choose?
     
  5. OP
    OP
    KurayamiLove
    Offline

    KurayamiLove Windraider

    405
    463
    296
    Mar 15, 2015
    Female
    Nautilus
    12:06 PM
    KurayamiLove
    Buccaneer
    69
    Halcyon
    The first job skills I know they become obsolete as well as other skills but every job is a different experience for the most part, so I like to suggest buffs that not only affect the endgame. Yes some jobs are significantly stronger than others but is hard to balance and keep the essence of a job, also many skills are hard-coded making them unable to change too much x-x
     
  6. Kimberly
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    Kimberly Administrator Staff Member Administrator Game Moderator

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    Just the default should do the job
     
  7. OP
    OP
    KurayamiLove
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    KurayamiLove Windraider

    405
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    Mar 15, 2015
    Female
    Nautilus
    12:06 PM
    KurayamiLove
    Buccaneer
    69
    Halcyon
    I thought black was the default that why I chose it o.o my bad, thanks for telling me, all this changing the colors made me do this :p
     
  8. OP
    OP
    KurayamiLove
    Offline

    KurayamiLove Windraider

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    Mar 15, 2015
    Female
    Nautilus
    12:06 PM
    KurayamiLove
    Buccaneer
    69
    Halcyon
    I added a couple more questions on Pirate
     
  9. OP
    OP
    KurayamiLove
    Offline

    KurayamiLove Windraider

    405
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    Mar 15, 2015
    Female
    Nautilus
    12:06 PM
    KurayamiLove
    Buccaneer
    69
    Halcyon
  10. NatteHond
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    NatteHond Skelegon

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    Apr 10, 2015
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    12:06 PM
    Privilege Checker
    White Knight
    Text is still black
     
  11. OP
    OP
    KurayamiLove
    Offline

    KurayamiLove Windraider

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    Mar 15, 2015
    Female
    Nautilus
    12:06 PM
    KurayamiLove
    Buccaneer
    69
    Halcyon
    Then I dont know how to fix it o.o is a bit late here Ill give it another look tmr morning sorry >.<
     
  12. Kanade
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    Kanade Slime

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    10:06 PM
    Loser.jpg

    Highlight text, Click Button, Click Color.
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  13. Ledyn
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    Ledyn Snail

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    12:06 PM
    Ledyn
    Warrior
    22
    It would be awesome if Warrior's Final Attack got some adjustments! The way it is now, it basically only makes a character worse. I don't think it's possible that it was intended to be like that.

    One way to fix it would be to increase it's damage so that the additional animation is worth it. But even then, it would still ruin mobbing skills. So another change would be to make it hit more than one monster or to reduce (or even remove) the time it takes to complete the animation.
     
  14. Kimberly
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    Kimberly Administrator Staff Member Administrator Game Moderator

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    Consider Final Attack to be pretty much unfixable. The code by NEXON (which is in the client) is one big hot mess, and even a server that likes the skill a lot (and did spend a lot of time on it) have a horrible time getting this skill somewhat useful, besides a pointless toggle (pointless because the skill is still very bad)
     
    • Creative Creative x 1
  15. Sarina
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    Sarina Brown Teddy

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    6:06 AM
    Oh I know, that's why I didn't put any points on Final Attack :p
     
  16. Zooploop
    Online

    Zooploop King Slime

    29
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    Aug 15, 2018
    Male
    6:06 AM
    Crusader
    I'd rather see Enrage become a party buff than have it off CD every time you want to use it. As it stands it's between it and Monster Magnet for the last maxed skill on a Hero (unless you're skipping Guardian entirely), and since it's worse than rage till level 20 one of the skills will be rendered useless. Giving an energizer to party for 4 minutes would be more meaingful. As an added bonus since it's 26 attack you can enrage over energizers ;)
     
  17. OP
    OP
    KurayamiLove
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    KurayamiLove Windraider

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    Mar 15, 2015
    Female
    Nautilus
    12:06 PM
    KurayamiLove
    Buccaneer
    69
    Halcyon
    As Kimberly said is a mess of a skill the issue is not the damage 250% is prettu good, the issues is how when you use a mobbing skill the damage gets divided by the amount of mobs you can hit with that skill, so using slash would decrease its dmg to 1/6 of that. For stuff like that I dont adress many stuff I want to change hehe
     
  18. Lidas
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    Lidas Master Chronos

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    Sep 14, 2017
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    1:06 PM
    Lidas
    Bowmaster
    138
    Great job on this.
    I feel like bowmasters fall short with the mob skills compare to other ranged classes.
    I will be happy to see mob skill that at least match nls when comparing dpm.while i think sairs and marksman should still be better on this part.
    I was thinking about changing inferno or arrowbomb. Rain is useful but most of the time i want to keep distance.
    As for dragon breath i agree that it should knock back at close range. Archers is the only class without mobility skill. And unlike others who can just jump to the other side of the map and attack, archers knock back skill is very important and they must be able to knock back at close range. While power kb should help, its not very good. It kb the monsters but not very far. And the attack range is short.
    But anyway The biggest issue i see with archers is the puppet dc problem.

    If i could order it will be:
    1. Puppet
    2. knockback
    3. dpm
     
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2019
  19. OP
    OP
    KurayamiLove
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    KurayamiLove Windraider

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    Mar 15, 2015
    Female
    Nautilus
    12:06 PM
    KurayamiLove
    Buccaneer
    69
    Halcyon
    I think the issue with NLs damage is the Luky7 /Ttriple Throw formula, it has a multiplier of 5 (same as spear but DK is far slower) bow multiplier is 3.4. Also the damage that the skill does is huge, 600ms per cast at cap speed (achiveable with booster) meaning 300 real stars that do 150% each and 300 shadow starts throw by the shadod partner doing half of the dmage the real stars do. on top of that they have so much avoid that they can do dmg without being interupted too often. Corsais beacon and batelship cannon make them very strong at 1vs1 (even better than nl) only issue with them is that they cant constaly avoid attacks like NL, the moment a boss fights back corsair dmg gets lower than NLs.
    Im not sure if Kimberly would be cool or able to touch base formulas like the range ones mudifiying multipliers or special formlas like TT so for now I think these changes for now are cool.
    BTW I think BM is better at mobing than NL since arrow rain doesnt cast a punch animation
     
  20. OP
    OP
    KurayamiLove
    Offline

    KurayamiLove Windraider

    405
    463
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    Mar 15, 2015
    Female
    Nautilus
    12:06 PM
    KurayamiLove
    Buccaneer
    69
    Halcyon
    I did that and tried to select none but still black o.o
     

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