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Do paladins need a buff?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by akashsky, Sep 3, 2020.

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  1. akashsky
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    akashsky Horntail

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    Hello I'm Akash, one of the top paladin players on this server (this isn't something that I aimed for, but something that sort of just happened as a byproduct of dual client attacking with my corsair and paladin).

    In this thread, I want to discuss the current state of paladin in horntail, and give some actual facts about the current situation. Whether or not paladins need a buff will be left to the reader to decide, but the information that I present should be helpful in deciding the balance.

    Strategy 1: Single target
    In the single target strategy, the paladin mainly uses blast as their main attack. In the beginning of the body, you focus the tail, while using heavens hammer off cooldown. Post nerf this means that each of your hammers does 400k damage while 8 parts are up to cleave. After tail / legs you go for middle head and ONLY blast (using HH here is a waste if you are strong enough). If head B cancels and head A is down, you go to head C and cleave arm + wing + head C with advanced charge blow.

    Dpm 1 strategy 1:
    [​IMG]
    6.742m. This was with ciders. 12 att cape, 17 att gloves, 145 attack dragon claymore.

    Dpm 2 strategy 1:
    [​IMG]
    7m dpm
    Equips: 12 attack cape, 17 attack gloves, 126 att claymore on stew.
    This is roughly equivalent to perfect weapon on cider.

    Strategy 2: Hybrid Cleave
    In this strategy, you start where other cleavers do, where you cleave wings / arm / leg and do not use HH. Alternatively u can also start on legs / tail and use ACB and use hammer off cooldown.

    After legs are down, you go to tail and use blast + HH. After leg is down you go up to middle head. After head A dies, and you have the choice to attack the middle head or Head C, you prefer to cleave head C, wings, and right arm over blast head B. In this situation you are "cleaving" more than the single target strategy, hence higher dpm, (though a bit of it is wings / arm).

    Strategy 2: DPM
    [​IMG]
    Stew, 12 att cape, 17 att glove, 126 claymore (roughly equivalent to perfect claymore on cider)
    7.5m dpm

    Now, this is the state of paladin post nerf. Prior to nerf, I could achieve 9.5m using the single target strategy on cider. On HT buff, i could get 10m. On Stew, I could reach 10.5m

    [​IMG]
    Shown above is pre-nerf paladin.
    12 attack cape, 17 attack gloves, 147 attack 2h speargraive on stew.

    So, the real problem here is that strategy 2 is only decent on compositions with little to no cleave. If you have a cleaver, strategy 1 is the better.

    So, on a standard run, an end game paladin loses about 2.5m dpm from the hammer nerf in horntail.

    In terms of tier list, this puts paladin below archers in terms of single target dps. The hybrid cleave strategy makes them roughly equivalent to archers (but this isn't as viable if you have an actual cleaver on your run).

    Overall in terms of balance, its not really that bad. An end game paladin can still carry their weight on a 5-6man run, but the class itself is simply not good enough for a 4man run (hence SelquinSelquin meme)
    [​IMG]

    My personal opinion is that the nerf leaves paladins as a playable class, but it makes the paladin class only good as a mule, and not as a main. Cwkpq and horntail are the only truly worthwhile pieces of content in ML for attackers. Paladins as a class are not desirable for either of these, so therefore, the best reason to make a paladin would be to do the content they are good in (scarlion, NT). You would want your main character to be something that performs well in Cwkpq and HT, since they are the best end game content.

    That being said, you can still carry your own weight in a 1 party run on a paladin. You'll just need to be quite a bit more funded than your peers to add enough value to be worthwhile to bring (or simply use higher attack potions).

    If any change is implemented, the one I would like to see most is a reduction on the delay of heavens hammer. As it stands, bossing with an end game paladin is quite boring. Having heavens hammer delay be reduced to be the same as 1 blast would make it worthwhile to cast it in horntail. It would also give a well played paladin the DPM boost they need to be a more desirable attacker.

    Ultimately its up to staff to decide, but basically the question will boil down to whether losing 2.5m dpm on this class is too much or just enough of a nerf.
     
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