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My next skill changes wish list.

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by KurayamiLove, Apr 9, 2020.

  1. KurayamiLove
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    KurayamiLove Skelegon

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    Introduction
    I like to argue about the game's mechanics and balance with other people, so I'm making yet another post with some skill changes I would like to see and the reasons why I think those changes would be good to have. Enjoy and don't be afraid of giving me a piece of your mind.

    Common skills

    [​IMG] Hero's Will

    >Make this skill heal all the status effects.
    The only use of this skill is to get rid of seduce in a pinch. I think this skill would be much more useful if you could get rid of any status effect, including stun. The big cooldown of it won't make it take over all-cure potions or holy shield, and getting rid of stuns during a boss like Zakum wouldn't make the boss easier. On Vergamot that could even save your life on the last body since if you mess up and get hit by the explosion, you will get stunned and if after that you get seduced you won't be able to heal or move away from the boss and die unless you get lucky with shifter, misses, have enough hp to tank hits or being healed by a Bishop.

    Bowmen skills

    Marksman

    [​IMG] Piercing Arrow

    >Disable the melee attack on this skill.
    You spent some time charging a shot to destroy your enemies but oops Mr. Kamikaze dude shoved his ugly face on your Xbow, you can't unleash the powerful arrow now, is illegal, now you have to bitchslap that dude like a moron. Now seriously this scenario happens a lot and it would be good to remove it entirely. I think people want some Marksman buffs, and when they think of it they want more single target damage to matches their brother Bow Master, but what if we made the job better at mobbing with this change?

    [​IMG] Blind

    >Make this skill work on bosses but with a reduced effect, perhaps half or 1/3 of its original effect including the chance of applying blind.
    This change could make Marksman a better support option making their teammates avoid more damage if they are around constantly damaging the boss. The reduction of the effects would be needed to perhaps not make this skill way too good, but overall I think this would be a neat change.


    Thief Skills

    [​IMG] Ninja Ambush

    >Bring back the ability to damage bosses with it again.
    The damage at max level is very low so even if you could damage a boss during a cancel this skill is still terrible. I suggested in the past to change the formula to make it do more damage (even like that it would be bad tho) so if we are not getting that let's let it do what it was doing before.

    Shadower

    [​IMG] Daggers

    >Change the multiplier from 3.6 to 4
    Daggers are weird, while carried by a warrior their multiplier is 4 but when used by a thief they have a multiplier of 3.6. This change would increase the range of Shadower by 10.6666% or so.

    [​IMG] Smoke Screen

    >Make it so it prevents status as well.
    Nothing can now bother you for an entire minute, go take a pee now... fast!.
    Making a bit better Shadower support options is always a good thing.

    [​IMG] Chakra

    >Remove the need of being half HP to use this skill
    Maybe like that Shadowers would use it? Like Night Lord stopping to drain they could stop to heal themselves as well at any time, losing damage in the process of course.


    Pirate

    Corsair Skills

    [​IMG] DEX to avoid ratio

    >Increase the DEX to avoid ratio from 8DEX=1Avoid to 4DEX=1Avoid
    The new ratio is the ratio that, thieves, bowmen, magicians, and warriors have. For some reason, Corsair avoid formula makes it so they gain half the avoid from the same dex as the rest of the jobs so let's make it so it matches the rest. That will make bosses scratch a lot less our ships, I'm not even done paying the damn thing!

    [​IMG] Battleship

    >Make it so when you disconnect the ship HP goes back to full. And perhaps fully heal the ship after being inactive for a long time (around 10 minutes perhaps, up to debate).
    I don't know if it's possible to flush and set to a default value the memory assigned to the ship's HP so by relogging it could heal up instead of destroying it before every boss run, and perhaps if the ship is not being used for long it could heal up so when you are not actively damaging enemies it could be ready for action when you go back to it. I don't think is overpowered since you would either have to get out of the boss by disconnecting to heal it or not use the ship and lose al to of damage to heal it.

    Buccaneer Skills

    [​IMG] Energy Charge

    >Increase the time from 50 to 120 seconds, Double charge rate if a boss monster is hit.
    This change would make Energy Charge far more reliable as well as more interactive, managing the charge would be far more engaging and would fix a lot of Buccaneer's issues.
    Having more access to charge skills won't make the job that much better since most of them are a bit situational and having them available for longer while grinding won't change much, and having them more often on bosses won't change the gameplay that much, the big change is the fact that now you can take advantage more of the stance the skill has to perform better at bosses and make it more strategies in my opinion.

    Warrior Skills

    Paladin

    [​IMG] [​IMG] Holy/Divine Charge
    > Damage increase from 140% to 160%
    Behold the 4th job charge, its useless. Any monster that is weak to holy is also weak to lighting a charge that you already maxed and doesn't need books and 4th job skill points.
    There are 2 exceptions as far as I know: Skelegons ( a monster that you just wipe with Heavens Hammer anyways) and one of the ninjas that Red Nirg summons when it's defeated (that ninja doesn't last long). More damage on this charge would make it neat for bosses that are weak to both Lighting and Holy (and still plenty of lighting weak bosses to not make lighting not useless at all) and to use as your second charge when the boss resists fire.

    Dragon Knight

    [​IMG] [​IMG] Spear/Polearm Crusher
    >Increase the speed from 810ms per cast at cap speed to 750ms per cast at cap speed.
    A small damage buff for DK that won't make them outdamage Paladin or Hero in 1vs1 damage or make them stronger than Hero when comes to cleaving. This damage buff is more to compensate a bit for the Berserk skill limiting the job and making it very expensive when comes to bosses. They will still be a good support with Hyper Body, they just will get more damage after all the hard work they do.


    Thank you for reading. I look forward to debating these changes and more with you guys.
     
    • Like Like x 9
    • Great Work Great Work x 3
  2. Selquin
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    Selquin Headless Horseman

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    Seems reasonable for the most part, but I really don't think you can justify changing dagger multiplier from 3.6 --> 4.0. Most people believe that the current shadowers are either balanced or perhaps even slightly overbuffed, this would definetly push them over the edge.
     
    • Agree Agree x 7
  3. OP
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    KurayamiLove
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    KurayamiLove Skelegon

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    On my perspective pushing their dmg just a bit further shouldn't harm the job. And perhaps the job gets new adepts. I could be wrong tho. Edit: Also I think changing Assassinate to make it more functional seems like a lost cause x-x
     
    • Like Like x 1
  4. HollyCrap
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    HollyCrap Capt. Latanica

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    I would also add a Snipe skill change making so it hits through weapon cancel

    Really nice list
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  5. OP
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    KurayamiLove
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    KurayamiLove Skelegon

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    That would be neat and I saw that suggestion and is neat but not sure if it's possible to apply. lets hope it is
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  6. MrPresident
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    MrPresident Capt. Latanica

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    I’m not sure how big of an impact increasing crusher speed would be but I don’t think any of the endgame DK want more damage/speed. In my opinion DK are already very strong and don’t need any damage buffs. The 2 major downsides imo for a DK are the lack of potion options and how their weapons are locked behind gacha/events. I’ve already ranted enough about these problems on other threads so I won’t here but outside of these 2 problems I think DK are in a very good state atm.

    also a dagger buff would be a very bad idea imo. Shads are already very strong after the Nate buff and I’m on the side that shad are slightly over buffed atm.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  7. akashsky
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    akashsky Horntail

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    Very decent list, except the dagger buff. IMO, shadower needs to less DPS on boss runs compared to other classes in order to balance their insane avoid and survivability.

    I especially like the HEROs will suggestion.

    As per the dex avoid buff on corsairs, I think that change would single handedly change them from the worst class in horntail to one of the best single target, just under nightlord.
     
  8. OP
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    KurayamiLove
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    KurayamiLove Skelegon

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    Hey, guys, I see the multiplier idea was bad, I take notes, guess I underestimated Shadowers haha. Glad they are so neat.
    About the DK thing MrPresidentMrPresident I played one and I love the class, they are at a very nice spot but I always have that thing on my mind, all that extra pots and getting used to Berserk efficiently to in the end getting less than the rest of warriors while having fewer defense capabilities. So I played with numbers and saw that the difference with similar gear and weapons (sky ski,stonetooth hero and skull paladin) the other 2 warriors were passing the 10m dpm easily while I hovered around 8m so with some numbers I tried to make the damage to get a it closer perhaps around 9m without passing them since I know DK has a very good support skill on HB.
     
  9. RainbowYarn
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    RainbowYarn Pink Teddy

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    Make Sniper's Blizzard able to crit. Cause why not? No reason not to. Simple as that.
     
  10. Alyosha
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    Alyosha Skelegon Retired Staff

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    My math seems to show that Dark Knight single-target DPM would be higher than Heroes/Paladins(fire neutral) if their attack speed was decreased to 750ms with comparable gear. But then again it is a pretty garbage class and could probably use something. Ask most 18x+ DKs if you should make a DK and they'll probably tell you not to.
    SeemsGood

    At 810 ms:
    DK average DPM: (1200(str) x 5(str multiplier) x .86(average mastery) + 60(dex)) x 200(attack)/100(attack scaling) x 1.91(Crusher damage with SE) x 3(Crusher lines) x 2(Berserk) x 74(attacks per minute)
    DPM = 8.853mil

    At 750 ms:
    (1200 x 5 x .86 + 60) x 200/100 x 1.91 x 3 x 2 x 80
    DPM = 9.57mil

    Hero would be 9.245mil

    Paladin:
    Fire neutral = 9.409mil
    Fire weak = 14.114mil
    Thunder weak = 12.098mil
    Ice weak = 10.081mil

    I did the math here

    I'd still rather have accessibility than damage. Most content feels unplayable without losing money on all the potions, getting KO'd because bosses hit more than the inverse of any reasonably priced potions, or doing bishop-levels of damage if you can't zerk.

    Outside of Horntail there are no Dark Knights, just HB mules.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  11. Anon
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    Anon Horny Mushroom Retired Staff

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    Always enjoy a good skill change thread. Thanks for making it.

    On your changes I think most of them would be a nice change.
    Particularly the DK one. I haven't played the class in a while, but it's always bothered my that they are in-general (and feel free to correct me if wrong) the weaker of the warriors as far as general DPM despite the fact they have to 'work' for their DPM with Berserk. As opposed to Hero and Pally where all their damage comes from their powerful self-buffs.
    Additionally, It always seemed weird to me that Crusher is the only(?) skill to change it's attack speed depending on how many points are put into it. It goes from 690ms (with SI) to 810ms once it has 16+ points in it. Just weird.

    I definitely think Corsair could use a little love too which you've made some nice suggestions for.
    And Marksmen definitely need some love, but I don't know the class at all if I'm honest.
     
  12. OP
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    KurayamiLove
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    KurayamiLove Skelegon

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    My math showed something different I may need to look into it. I have a lv 189 DK with pretty good gear, I love the job and I think is a pretty awesome job just I feel like I work so hard on consistency and I get fewer results than the rest of the warriors. I want to find a speed that would make DKs a bit better, just a bit. I know that they can HB but at times I just feel you are there just for that, specially at a boss like Toad where u cant really zerk that well if you even try, let alone Pink Bean if it releases. I will look into my numbers, thanks for your input.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  13. OP
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    KurayamiLove
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    KurayamiLove Skelegon

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    Alsoya is right with his numbers so better buff it less perhaps? I'm aware of the speed change between skill levels but the 3 hits version is much more damage in the end. Thats the feeling I get from playing DK, work more spend more Mesos to get less and all cos you can pres the HB key every few mins, btw can we have a 200 secs HB? o.o. Still if you like DK gameplay like I do still play it I love the class with others that are not as popular like Buccaneer, love story since it got out in EMS still till today.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  14. OP
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    KurayamiLove
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    KurayamiLove Skelegon

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    I wonder if making Snipe damage fixed to 199,999 would raise a bit the dpm pf MM.
     
    • Creative Creative x 1
  15. xadra
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    xadra Capt. Latanica

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    Strongly agree with the Holy Charge one, god knows why it's as utterly worth nothing at all even though having a holy charge fits the theme of being a paladin so well. Might as well rename as "Elemental Knight" or "Hexblade" actually. 160% on holy and maybe adding holy weakness to a couple of bosses where it thematically fits (black crow maybe?) would be pretty cool and give a reason to add skill points. But even then it'll probably be last priority after blast, ACB, HH, stance, guardian and achilles.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  16. akashsky
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    akashsky Horntail

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    Also include rush and maple warrior. So you would maybe max it at like 19x?
     
  17. SwordnBoard
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    SwordnBoard Selkie Jr.

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    It would be interesting to see holy/divine charge buffed, or mobs changed to make it a better option.

    As it is now i dont even skill it, its functionally useless compared to the other options.

    Hell its almost wasted SP unless you grind nothing but skeles.
     
  18. joota
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    joota Mr. Anchor Retired Staff

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    Great list! I generally agree with the comments others have written. One change I'd make is that for buccaneers, charge shouldn't be twice as fast. At the cleave bosses at cwk for example, buccs would basically have energy charge at all times if they use DS+SSK. Instead I'd make it 120 seconds where every attack charges by line (i.e. DS/SSK/multihit skills would charge the same while each barrage would charge 6 times and each demolition would charge 8 times). I'd also add the change I've mentioned before of SI stackable with booster as +1/+2 instead of unstackable with booster as +3/+4.
     
  19. OP
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    KurayamiLove
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    KurayamiLove Skelegon

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    The sad thing is that is not even good at Skeles. Since you max HH so early in the job you are better off using that then clean with Rush, and when you are done cleaning use HH again. Charge weakness often comes handier in bossing. I thought that 160% would make it a better neutral charge when fire fails and you swap to your second charge (currently thunder). Even if we buff the damage it would only come handy at 2 bosses: Anego and Katsu Musha. Changign weakness around would work too. I wonder if we change weakness around we should make holy 150% as well.
    EDIT:
    I always see the Paladin quirk to be the charges and getting a new charge should be a good thing but sadly holy charge is bad I want to make it fit on the arsenal hehe.
     
  20. OP
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    KurayamiLove
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    KurayamiLove Skelegon

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    What I want is a more reliable Charge source, like charge is something you manage instead of being that sporadic. then 120 sec duration is a change I really wish its made and I hope the GMs agree. Now the charge rate, I took the change from post big bang (with the 120 sec duration) the charge relating to the amount of hits instead of the monster hits would make it a lot better as well and I like that, would be the same as the change I said but no need to use mobbing skills. Mostly on bosses you hit 3 parts on the multipart bosses (Zak arms, HT) with snatch perhaps up to 4. Anyways faster charge on bosses overall and better duration would make Bucc perfect, in a sense of completely well balanced. The usage of charge skill is neat yet not that OP: Drain is ok and is a small improvement on the DPS (Barrage>Drain x2 is better than Barrage>Dragon Strike), the improvement is so small but you get to recover some HP; Energy Blast is very rarely used on bosses unless you are clearing sumons around, grinding still would be the same since you get charge so fats anyways; and Energy Orb is Ok, an even better option over Barrage>Dragon Strike combo for 1vs1 yet not as good is you are cleaving so is situationally good (I would still max it the last skill perhaps going back to adding to SI to max it) and for mobbing is kinda ok, the first 3 mobs take lots of damage the rest not so much.

    The SI fix would be a nerf actually, as it is right now if people don't use their booster is ok, no bugs. Ther nerf? is for Bishops, is the only job without a booster so they would be getting +2 instead of +4 as if they had a booster all along. So keeping SI like this only benefits them so I don't mind keeping SI as it is now.

    Now last small note, I really want a Charge skill mask on the corner with the rest of the skills, like in post big bang, really helps managing the skill.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1

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