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Increase Level Requirement for APQ!

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by YandereAlice, Jun 11, 2024.

  1. YandereAlice
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    YandereAlice Red Snail

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    2:48 AM
    There are far too many people making low level mules for APQ, and this is what it has come down to:
    • A party for APQ requires at least one attacker ideally around level 130 to kill the geist balrog. With the number of mules showing up lately, party comps often consist of 5 mules one attacker. If that one attacker disconnects, (or dies), that run is dead.
    • Additionally, with such a low requirement, it's more difficult to form parties especially when people with ONLY mules and NO attackers/mage ults make 6 level 40 characters and always expect to be carried on every run. It's even worse when they afk throughout the run cause they cannot do anything.
    • With the number of mules, prices of apples is tanking hard. Players that actually use apples are the ones doing mid-endgame bossing. and the number of mules getting apples per run greatly exceeds the number of apples used in bossing content. Which is why there is an oversupply in apples in the market.
    Personally, I'd like the level requirement to be at 120. but reasonably, 80-90 should be a good number. Here's why:
    • At level 80, you should be able to deal minimal damage to the boss and survive 1-2 hits of the boss's attacks. I've seen few level 40-45 mules (including myself) die in almost 1 shot (especially un-hp-washed characters). Also you will have some SP set by then to not only contribute in the pq at all stages of the pq, but have an easier and faster time collecting keys as well.
    • Given the amount of time given for an APQ run, 6 level 80-90 characters should be able to kill the boss. Which makes it less dependent on having a level 130 attacker in the party
    • You could argue that this would be a disadvantage for lower level players, especially for newer players. However, I deem that with the addition of this level requirement for APQ, it can serve as another motivation (with speculated increase in apple prices), a leveling milestone for players to achieve. .
     
    • Agree Agree x 5
  2. GooBeR
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    GooBeR Timer

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    Aug 29, 2021
    2:48 AM
    It's the host's fault if the party is a bunch of sub 100's that can't deal damage. But it isn't really a problem I have noticed. Also, locking APQ to fourth job will just remove the only viable money making method for new players with no fourth job. Before all the new players showed up it took forever to run APQ during certain times of the day, now it doesn't really take that long to find a party. These changes will mean less runs just for the off chance that your entire party can't kill the boss. The limiting factor for APQ has always been filling up the 6 required slots in a party. I don't really find the lower than normal price of apples to be a reason to restrict more players from doing content together.

    I'm not opposed to mules in an APQ, but I am opposed to all these mules AFKing while they are collecting keys on another character or are in another run. Should be reported and some type of punishable offense. Lock their whole account out of APQ's for a while.
     
    • Agree Agree x 7
  3. Godfry
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    Godfry Red Snail

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    Oct 17, 2023
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    4:48 AM
    Bishop
    All of these points are extremely valid, and I want to comment on the first point of the second list, which is important when treating APQ as a PQ first and foremost. All of the PQs' have a level range that allows any character within the range to have a chance to actually complete the PQ. APQ is unique in that the absolutely best geared lv. 40-60 characters don't even begin to have a chance with the boss (CERTAINLY not with Geist), and I think the difficulty is a good thing! The last point in the last list is also very true, it would be a huge motivator to level up more, and APQ would be even more fun without just the repetitive mule/carry relationship, but 80-110's working together to defeat the boss. Upping the level requirement would be a fantastic change!!!
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  4. ColPanda
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    ColPanda Blue Snail

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    Jun 23, 2023
    6:48 PM
    This is a reasonable suggestion! Now, the players can form party and clear the without having to sorely rely on high level players. And hopefully this sways players from growing the "I'm just a mule" mindset. Recently with the increased number of APQ mules, I have been witnessing too many players that afks from the first stage.
    Great recommendation imo :) ty for the post
     
  5. lv1crook
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    lv1crook Capt. Latanica

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    2:48 AM
    Level1Crook
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    Realistically there isn’t much reason for any player below 70 to be inside without getting hard carried so I sorta agree. At the same time, it is not really a pressing issue. I’d rather them fix the couples bonus stage (again since it’s still broken since the last time).

    If they do make changes to the level requirement, they should also make adjustments to the EXP, since it is actually pretty decent for level 50 at the moment.
     
  6. ColPanda
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    ColPanda Blue Snail

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    Jun 23, 2023
    6:48 PM
    I agree with you on the lowered price of apple cannot be reason for this change. However, I do support the post about point of contribution being a reasonable and important factor.

    Recently, the common issue I am running into when hosting APQ has been that people AFK from stage one. When I ask why, the common response has been that they just aren't capable of killing it. With the character being at higher lvl (not to the degree of 4th job but somewhere in 80-90 range), they now will have the capability to contribute in all stages.

    But to your point, higher lvl players also afk so I do agree with you that they should implement some sort of penalty system to punish that type of behavior.
     
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2024
  7. Juneriffic56
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    Juneriffic56 Horny Mushroom

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    2:48 AM
    JuneBleep
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    Honestly I think a change that could help with the party comp issue is to simply get rid of the immunities on the 3rd phase of the boss.

    Cause in my experience, not counting myself, I'm pretty likely to get some 130+ members every run, but I swear they're almost always a mage of some kind (usually bishop) and the boss is literally immune to all elements except lightning for some reason?? Feels pointless to arbitrarily punish Bishop and FP but not IL. Sure, you can magic claw or BB, but it's almost guaranteed to be a slog if that's your only source of damage. I don't think it'd kill anyone if bishops could spam angel ray or even ult and FP could spam paralyze on the boss.
     
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2024
    • Agree Agree x 4
    • Great Work Great Work x 1
  8. LeonardoJF
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    LeonardoJF Horntail

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    Jun 16, 2021
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    6:48 AM
    ItzLeo
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    The bad thing is that depending on what time you go there are few runners, but overall it can be a positive thing.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  9. ColPanda
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    ColPanda Blue Snail

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    Jun 23, 2023
    6:48 PM
    Agreed! It is brutal for FP and Bishop. Since all you can do is either Bigbang or Magic Claw. And usually BB is learned in much higher lvl due to its limited use.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  10. penips
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    penips Mano

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    Nov 9, 2023
    9:48 PM
    Ooo wow, that is a really good suggestion!

    I feel like this is a pretty good solution to the problem presented by OP as it kind of solves the issue by increasing the range of party compositions that are able to clear the boss stage, while also not excluding characters from being able to run due to an increased level cap.
     
  11. Subterlabor
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    Subterlabor Headless Horseman

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    3:48 AM
    SweatLord
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    1000000% agree

    I think the requirement should be level 70 since this is where alot of the servers faults begin (leech meta)

    Apple prices tanking do a bit of a disservice to apq runners. Level 40 mules is so easy to do its kind of ridiculous it isnt a higher level for the reward. I'm sure it would get a ton of backlash from the dedicated APQ runners since so many people basically retire doing nothing but apq.

    One of the bigger reasons I don't really APQ is I'm sick of having a bunch of afk jackasses who only "show up" when they really have to for the rope/combo stages and dont contribute, making it drag on even more
     
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2024
    • Agree Agree x 1
  12. Godfry
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    Godfry Red Snail

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    inb4 they make it immune to lightning too LOL
     
    • Great Work Great Work x 1
    • Creative Creative x 1
  13. Juneriffic56
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    Juneriffic56 Horny Mushroom

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    All my APQ characters are 120+, but I'm still not keen on the idea of raising the level cap. That being said, I think I could get behind 70 at least. It's a decent balance of not alienating newer players too bad while still making it more effort to make plentiful APQ mules. I do think it wouldn't be long before said APQ mules are 70, though, as I feel like players who sweat enough to have multiple APQ characters likely also have a mage to leech them up easy.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  14. fartsy
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    fartsy Zakum

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    just let the market balance the prices
     
    • Great Work Great Work x 5
  15. TORONTOTOKYO
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    TORONTOTOKYO Windraider

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    Oct 16, 2021
    5:48 PM
    replace the balrog with pap
     
  16. Krythan
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    Krythan Headless Horseman

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    5:48 AM
    Krythan
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    I see where you're coming from, but I disagree. In my opinion, APQ is unique in the way...
    1. It gives low level players an opportunity to meet and party with veterans.
    2. It gives low level players a (much needed) way to make income.
    3. It gives all players an alternative to grinding for gacha.
    The more people running APQ the better. I like that apples are getting cheaper. It provides a way for players to run end-game content at lower levels, and for organizers to be more flexible with party compositions... as apples can be used to compensate for lower dps, or save runs in the case of accidents.

    As far as I'm concerned, carrying low level players is a party leader problem. Don't want to carry a low level? Don't add them to the party. The more people running and available to join for APQ, the better.
     
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2024
    • Agree Agree x 4
  17. LeonardoJF
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    LeonardoJF Horntail

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    ItzLeo
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    yes, i agree with you mate!
    also, last apq i did was a lv 4x that know how to do most things
     

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